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  1. Past hour
  2. Proposal coming Monday. Not done, but apparently deal is close Edit: Someone actually calling it a tentative deal that council would need to approve to make it a done deal
  3. Today
  4. I think if Dube is going to be part of this next season this is how the forward group needs to line up. given no trades other than Frolik out. Who they select as 13 and 14 for forwards could address some size or toughness options, maybe Lomberg and Tuulola. On defense, trade or buy out Stone and keep Brodie, maybe he deserves a good run at a SC with us as his last hoorah here.
  5. think were all in agreement with many factors winning cups. Sure players like Sundqvist are unsung heros but my point is we are talking about a 3rd liner and not someone who is that difficult to find. So the idea that the Flames are not drafting for what wins cup, that's where I was disagreeing. Sure, that grit is important but IMO it's not as important as skill and the foundation to the team is skill. I can see a day where a team wins a cup (and I actually think you can argue this has already happened) without having that guy. I don't think you will ever win a cup without most of your team being skilled, but yes you need to find those auxiliary pieces.
  6. I guess you could do that as well. EDM should deal Puljujarvi because the situation has gone sour there, I just don't know if they will do it with the Flames.
  7. I agree with not doing anything with EDM where we end up with Lucic, rather have Neal. I would take one shot with the deal I proposed Stone at 1.75M and our 2020 1st for Puljujarvi. Stone is only a 1 year commitment and Holland gets a do over at the 2020 draft. If we have Lindholm, Neal and Puljujarvi to work in on RW we should be OK.
  8. Not sure we could pry Toffoli out of LA. But we could possibly trade Stone to ANA for a 5th or 6th
  9. Any interest in a Brodie/Czarnik for Toffoli/ Clifford. LA needs D they only have 3 NHL caliber D. Hiring Mclellan isn't a rebuilding move. Play Toffoli on the top line and he scores 30 guaranteed
  10. Sometimes the stars just align for a team. The blues got some valuable contributions from players on their elc's such as Thomas, Dunn, Blais, and especially Binnington. Good players on great contracts seem to make all the difference but even then you need some luck. I would continue building like the flames have in recent years by going for skill over grit. Even if that means signing a few long shot undrafted players who've shown they can be productive but may lack certain characteristics.
  11. Yesterday
  12. I would say 6' at 200lbs is the start of having size, then it becomes a fine line past 6'5" of how your size plays in the NHL. This is not to say players under 6' not going to be as effective as the bigger players, just a matter of how they stand up to taking and dishing out the punishment.
  13. Zadorov is one of the most feared/dirtiest hitters in the NHL. Him along with Cole made our forwards pay the price. They made a difference.
  14. Obviously, grit alone doesn't win a Cup and doesn't replace elite goaltending, etc. Just saying, it's right up there in terms of importance and should not be overlooked and cast off as a bonus item to have. It's one of the main ingredients to every Cup team. You have to have players willing to play the "bad guy". Sundqvist injuring Grezllejskerskdnfsdfsmnd caused the Bruins to tinker with their D pairings and utilization, for example. Sundqvist was an unsung hero for the Blues despite not showing up on the score sheet. Again, that alone doesn't win Cups but you cannot win a Cup without that.
  15. Two sides of the coin. COL had none, which was my point.
  16. It would have to be Frolik for Puljujarvi and Manning. That would be close in gross value. We could just demote Manning, or maybe just have him play BoA games and target Draisaitl (Manning and McDavid are buddies now). Essentially, the Oilers get an effective player on a one year contract who can put up 40 points on any line. They give up an inconsistent young players with a questionable ceiling. And they dump 2.25m off the cap for Manning. We can demote him and save a million. The other option is Puljujarvi and Gagner for Frolik + 2nd. We can buy him out with a cap hit of 1m + change. Or we can use him on the 4th line with Mangiapane and Ryan. If we play him, we are about 1m higher in cap than just keeping Frolik, but we buy out Stone instead.
  17. BPA is very subjective though. Like, was Jakob Pelletier (LHS LW, 5'-9" 160lbs) clearly BPA over Bobby Brink (RHS RW, 5'-8" 159 lbs)? Why not draft the RHS?? I've never seen these two play but i imagine the difference is so close.
  18. I completely agree, Gaudreau is an anomaly. However, I would also suggest that anomalies like this should be expected in a good drafting/development system. Every decent organization always has a few surprises like this at all times. Gaudreau is against every odd, every rule, except one: Every lottery has a winner. The Theo Fleury lottery. The Martin St Louis lottery. The Kipper lottery. The Giordano lottery. All anomalies. All unexpected. But at a macro level we should know that good BPA systems will continue to supply these prospects. Don't buy them too high, don't sell them too low. This is where we've struggled. If you continue to draft/sign the best available prospects, you Can expect to get more anomalies than a team which drafts to fit. And those anomalies are typically worth more over time than the players who were drafted to fit.
  19. Problem with that question is there is no answer. I could say no, but they did win so how could I say that?. Breaking it down to that simple of a level ignores that they got the best goaltending in the playoffs and were still lead by skill. Do I think a 4th line in Barbashev and a bottom pairing Dman in Bortuzzo made the difference over guys like Benington, Schwartz or ROR? No. I don't feel that is the only debate. the debate seems to be the Flames are not valuing in tangibles enough in their draft process and should focus more on things like RH shots, grit, sandpaper, size etc etc. If the debate is simply the flames need some more sandpaper in their bottom 6, that's pretty easy yes they do. But that's doesn't really seem to be the way the discussion has gone.
  20. Ya agree here. We have too many LW as is. I think it's fair value to trade Frolik + 3rd rounder for Puljujarvi but Oilers cannot take on more cap.
  21. Gaudreau is a huge anomaly though you must admit. A once in a decade fluke. We might be able to trade Gaudreau straight up for Marner... but hard to believe any team will give up their #1 Center for a #1 LW. Not that that's the point. Just generally speaking, we need to put more value in RHS than LHS. It's hard to move a LD for a RD, for example. Teams have too many LDs and not enough RDs. Draft RHS and then you can trade "up" for a LHS anytime.
  22. Bennett-1RW Brings speed, skill and grit. BP needs to start here and not stop until Bennett proves he can not do the job. Bring in Quine/Pospisil-4LW Neal/Lucic-2/4 RW Dube-3RW w/Backlund
  23. ...Because we didn't have any.
  24. So real the question is, would STL have won without the dirtiness of Sundqvist, Barbashev, and Bortuzzo? That's all that's being debated here.
  25. Not sure I was arguing any such thing or that at all. I believe I mentioned about 4 qualities a team needs to have some balance throughout their line up.
  26. I think the Flames biggest problem was once they realized they had a top 10 league point player in Gaudreau they should have focused their draft on complementing HIM with size and skill picks. This season when JG had a good game we added 2 points. When he was shut down and immobilized we lost. We should have built a team around him. Some might say BT brought in Neal for that purpose but that ship sailed.
  27. There is a difference in a bromance and wanting to keep one of the best players in the league. Trade him for Laine and we have a similar problem with defensiveness, and created a hole in the playmaker department. Trade him for Schenn and we have a C that had a good post-season but might follow that up with a less productive regular season. Unless we are getting a player as important to the offense as Gaudreau, why bother talking about it.
  28. sak22

    The Undrafted

    Excellent point. Lets remember there is a team that is plenty tough up north, Kassian, Lucic, and Nurse can goon it up like nobody. Khaira, Larsson, Klefbom, Draisatl all big bodies, add in McDavid has a mean streak of his own. Yet where have they been, argument can be made that they had more playoff wins in their "run" than we have the entire decade, and that was when they had another goon in Maroon, but they hit an ice cold Sharks team and lost to a sloppy playing Ducks team so it wasn't a playoff that most teams would hang their hat on. Also Ryan Reaves was so valuable that he wasn't even used in game 7 OT. Evander Kane had how many goals in the playoffs?
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