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Showing content with the highest reputation since 08/20/2021 in Posts

  1. 7 points
    Lets try and move onto something more positive. I think there are some (gasp) reasons for optimism right now. For a few reasons. Almost every team is bad at drafting and developing goalies I looked at each NHL teams drafted goalies from 2005 through 2014 drafts. This covers ten drafts over the cap era without getting into guys who are still developing. I considered any goalie with at least 100 NHL starts as a success. 207 goalies were drafted over those 10 years. 16% of them played 100 games or more. Remove the career back-ups and your at 11%. Remove the guys who broke out with another team and you are at 9%. A third of the league went 10 drafts without getting an NHL goalie, just like Calgary (though Brossoit will likely break the 100 game mark, just not with Calgary). The point is, Calgary isn't unique in our lack of finding NHL goalies in the draft, and our struggles don't translate to a permanent curse. Tampa drafted and developed the best goalie in the NHL. They have drafted 28 goalies over the entire franchise and that was their only hit to date. We have a number of prospects worth paying attention to We have had prospects to get excited about in the past. I get the 'fool me once' tone, but its been a bit since we have had two AAA prospects and prospects across multiple levels. (NHL) Vlader was only moved due to to congestion in Boston's crease (sound familiar) and was moved versus losing him on waivers. He looked great 4 of the 5 NHL games he started for last season (and 5 was a throw away). His pro numbers are really good, and its tough to find many in the know who don't think this guy has NHL upside. A lot of Boston fans are really upset they lost him. (AHL/Junior) Wolf's numbers are insane. The Hockey Writers have him ranked as the 4 best goalie prospect in the NHL (one spot behind the guy who caused Vlader to be traded to Calgary), and that is pretty consistent across the league. Most prospect rankings have Wolf as our fourth best prospect, behind our three first round picks. If he wasn't a bit on the short side (for a goalie) he would be ranked higher. I know that height is an issue, but he isn't that short. Saros, Halak, Quick, Grubaur, etc are all similar height. (Others) Lets face it, the best goalies are often the ones we didn't expect. Sergeyev is a great dark horse prospect. He has passed every test handed to him, he just needs some tougher tests. Chechelev has put up some good numbers in Russia and is making his way to NA. Parsons was highly touted as a prospect before injury, but he rebounded well in the ECHL last season. I keep hearing good things about Werner even though his resume doesn't really scream future NHLer. I get that every team has these types of prospects, and most won't work out. But the Flames have a lot of bullets in this gun significantly improving the chance at a hit. The point is we will have valid prospects at the NHL level, AHL level, and one representing each of the last three drafts. Two of those prospects are highly ranked, with one of them listed as one of the best goalie prospects in the NHL. Meanwhile, we have no need to rush any of them as we have a legitimate NHL starter in net. Don't worry, be happy .... I know enough not to overplay the goalie hand. Its possible none of the guys above work out. But I can't remember the last time Calgary was this flush in legitimate NHL players and prospect at the G position. The history is a concern, but as I said above, that isn't unique to Calgary and some of the best goalies in the league were drafted and developed by teams who historically struggle doing that. I think goal tending prospects is an area of strength for the organization right now. It certainly isn't inline with the general tone of this thread.
  2. 6 points
    A list of players drafted 24 since Backlund: Mattias Tedenby/Marcus Johansson/Kevin Hayes/Matt Puempel/Malcolm Subban/Hunter Shinkaruk/Jared McCann/Travis Konecny/Max Jones/Kristian Vesalainen/Filip Johansson. Getting a 45 point C who is one of the better defensive players in the league at 24th is exceptional. Even take away his defensive ability and the situations he plays in. Getting a 45 point C late in the 1st is a win. But add that stuff back in and its a home run. Backlund has started in the defensive zone more often then any other Flames regular C over the past 5 seasons, its often against the other teams top lines, and he has still has the best possession numbers among Calgary Cs. He has often done it with limited line mates, and the line mates have all produced at a higher rate on his line then off. That includes recent guys like Tkachuk and Mangiapane. But it also includes guys like Bouma and Colborne that had career seasons playing next to him. The "Backlund Bump" is real. Over the last 5 seasons Backlund had 164 points even strength. Monahan had 195. To put that in perspective, every 11 games Monahan averaged 1 more point. That is with Backlund tasked with the defensive zone assignments and Monahan getting the offensive assignments. Funny enough, Backlund had 13 SH points over that time further narrowing the gap. Don't get me wrong, Monahan is the better offensive player. I also know, like every player, Backlund has his flaws. But he is disappointing because he isn't Patrice Bergeron? The Flames "killed all potential offensive output"? The guy has played almost 750 regular season games as a Flame, played the toughest minutes of any Flames forward, and he has done very well over that time. I have no idea why so many Flames fans crap on the guy.
  3. 5 points
    Go for it. If you follow other teams for as long as you've followed the Flames you'll find the exact same thing unless you jump from ship to ship. You make it sound like this is a Flames specific problem. I'm almost 40, teams I've never seen win the cup: Maple Leafs, Senators, Canucks, Sabres, Sharks, Jets/Coyotes, Thrashers/Jets, Wild, Panthers, Bluejackets, Predators, Flyers. 5 of those I've never seen in the finals. Then are teams that have existed before me that have only won 1 cup in my life, Blues, Capitals, Rangers, Stars, Whalers/Hurricanes, Bruins. Add in the Rangers have only won one cup in both mine and my dad's life despite never struggling to attract top free agents. Any team that has had success has had periods of being dreadful. Wings had a 40 year drought, Blackhawks 39 years, Kings 40+, Penguins probably wouldn't even exist if not for a couple generational players. This is sports, as bad as you think you have it there are plenty of fans just as depressed as you are.
  4. 3 points
    This. This is being over simplified and being presented in a binary argument and that's what bothers me about this debate. I don't think it as simple as saying this way or that way is the right way because it ignores way too many factors. Boston is a good example to hold up of a team built for long term success without a high pick, but that ignores that fact they got a likely Hall of fame center in the 2nd round. How often does that happen (spoiler alert.... it doesn't). It's easy to say "well then draft better" but that ignores that it's not like these opportunities are available in every draft. You don't get players the level of of Bergeron or Kucherov outside the top 10 as frequently anymore. New York Islanders, as already pointed out used a #4 pick to gain Barzal but also got Barzal because he had an injury his draft year. How often does a top 5 talent drop due to injuries (it happens but not every draft). They've also got a perfect match of GM, coach and roster that isn't always easy to do. People will say "sure it is" but what's interesting in including the Islanders in this category is several years ago (before Trotz) the Islanders would have been a case to hold up to say tanking doesn't work. They bottomed out and weren't any good. Yes you have teams like the Oilers, Leafs and Sabres who did it and it hasn't worked out yet but that's because, as Peeps points out here, it's only one step. I happen to believe the Leafs core is good enough to win but what they haven't gotten right yet is the mix around that core. You have to do both, which is what worked so well for LA, Chicago, Tampa and Pittsburgh. A high end core through the top of the draft, but also a good supporting cast too. for me it comes down to less of a this pathway or that pathway and more a consideration of where is your club, what are the current strengths/weaknesses of your club, and what are the up coming drafts like. I think you need to weight all of those when deciding whether or not this course make sense because even though a team may not be a cup contender or may not have a top 2 pick doesn't mean they have to rebuild. I am pro Flames rebuild because I think they have a strong prospect pool with depth, some good supporting characters in the right age range on their big league team but they lack the high end talent to be able to compete for cups, particularly down the middle. When you look at the strength of the next few drafts and the amount of high end talent available, combine it with what is already a solid base, I think you have the makings of a really exciting product in 3-4 years. That wouldn't' have been my answer in 2019 or 2020. Lots should factor into the analysis IMO and it shouldn't be as simple as either get a top 2 pick or you'll never win.
  5. 3 points
    Thanks kehatch for a NEW thread.lol I voted rebuild if we have another year like last year. But honestly, I think we have zoned in on some of the things that have really been hurting us. Not much change to the core, but I'm not positive the core has been the problem. A complete lack of 60 minutes of compete, no grit, no pushback, a team that always falls into a hole without the resilience to get out of it. When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging they say. The team's composition never did that. "Have Ritchie beat someone up"...never mattered. I like the adds, as residual as they seem. It will be the bottom 6 that keeps the entire roster up. So this is a retool to me. We've retooled our bottom 6, which was god awful. Most think it doesn't need move the needle, but I see it differently. Our bottom 6 is no longer going to get completely outworked so that is going to be a big boost. How the roster comes together is pretty exciting to me. Lots of parts and methods it seems. Pitlick, for me, is a nice add. He will chip in with secondary scoring. His career high is 15 goals playing with junk and doing it all by himself. Coleman always plays with a sense of urgency so that's a nice add for what has been a pretty vanilla team. When Sutter calls someone out in the media, Lewis and Richardson can talk to the player. "Yes. This is what he does. Don't get mad at him, get mad at yourself. He's not lying". Role players that know their role very well. Size on D. No more stick checking. Punish. Nothing slows a forward down more than being aware that there's a heavy hitter on the ice. As much as I don't see Gudbranson as a good add, I also have to wonder if Sutter has always been laughing at his usage. He wanted him here, so he likely sees something that I don't. Finally, this team filled me full of spite last year with their pathetic levels of, "try". Whining about it got tiring to the point that my give-a-crap-level was the same as theirs. But that's exhausting too. So I've stopped whining and it's a new season to watch and hope that fixing the bottom 6, piling in Dmen and G prospects is a good start. Now our top 6 has a platform to stand on. If they falter, then it's time to address that. I hope we've fixed a lot of the real problems now. Not long term solutions, but perhaps a better look at being a true 4 line team, built from the net out. Without skipping over the 3rd and 4th lines like we could just throw anyone there.
  6. 3 points
    Sutter mentioned a few times last year that the team just doesn't have the mental toughness needed to be successful. That's why they brought in 4 forwards that bring exactly that. I get that people wanna see goal scorers and points signings, but I'm happy they did it this way. The team's weak mentality had to change. Now they've added guys to help that. Lewis and Richardson aren't here for 20 goals apiece from 7 mins/gm. They know how to play their roles. We've been lacking that.
  7. 3 points
    It takes young lesser developed players time to grow into solid minds and bodies. Some guys develop faster. That's ok. Sometimes young guys find a way to get the job done. Having an Eichel would be a plus no doubt. The point I like the best is that Sutter will try to tighten up the neutral zone. That will improve any team defence. Like conundrumed said in not so many words, defence is the whole team. I think small market teams need to build differently than large market ones. A large physical gritty defensive team can still win a cup in today's game; there are already too many finesse teams in an already too large league (IMHO). Montreal lost the cup last season because of a handful of poor defensive plays (IMHO). (Whatever happened to taking 'good penalties'?... but that is a side discussion). I want to see the tiny and floating players traded for bigger hungrier ones. Sutter knows what needs to be done to win; Treliving, I'm not so sure. Another thing I like about conundrumed is his optimism. You don't get far when negativity sets in; you don't win shifts... you don't win games. We have all been there; we all know that. It's good to hear from you all again. I miss Flyersfan too.
  8. 3 points
    I just thought the post was funny but mostly because I'm not a fan of Will Nault so I thought it was a funny response. He's honestly made the fan shows almost unlistenable for me because he's just trying to be the contrarians in the discussion bur rarely does he actually have much to back up his opinion. I wasn't sure where Nault stood on Dube so I didn't in anyway way try to bring Kehatch into it. I respect his opinion too.
  9. 3 points
    It is a bit confusing but there are 2 different rules. The September 15th cutoff is for general AHL eligibility. You need to be 18 years old by September 15th to play in the AHL. CHL players are different due ot the transfer agreement between the AHL and NHL so that's why it's a calendar year for CHL players. Have to be 20 or turning 20 by the end of the year to be eligible. Zary is eligible for the AHL and I would strongly suspect that's where he'll be. He could go back to the WHL as an overeager but I will be surprised if that happens.
  10. 3 points
    I would suggest that Flames drafting has been a strength under Treliving. Its tough to rate the last three drafts, but there are some interesting names outside of the first two rounds including Wolf, Poirier, and Francis. 2018 is also tough to judge since they didn't pick until the 4 round But Pospisil and Pettersen both have potential and have shown pretty well at the AHL level. But the other three full drafts until Treliving were strong. He got Andersson, Kylington, and Mangipane in 2015 despite not having a first and only picking 5 times. Getting a top 6 forward and at least one top 4 D in that scenario is great drafting. Tkachuk was a no brainer in 2016, but they also picked a Norris winner in the third. Dube was also drafted this year, and Phillips still has a chance to make the NHL (I think he is a long shot, but I guess we will see). Two NHL stars in one draft is a big win, though there are a few unfortunate misses in there as well. 2017 is interesting. The jury is still out on Valimaki. Pretty sure he will be an every day NHLer, but I could see him anywhere from a top pairing to bottom pairing guy. Other then that they only picked 4 more times, and it wasn't until the fourth. Compare that to before Treliving got here (I include 2014 since he had just arrived). Excluding our top 6 picks (Bennett and Monahan), we only hit once in the first round since the 05 lockout (Backlund in 2007). Our non first round picks were pretty underwhelming as well wiht the exception of Brodie and Gaudreau. There are a few depth guys scattered here and there, but otherwise that's it. To be fair, Ferland could have been good if not for injury, and some people like Kulak. But no matter how you slice it, we had more success in Trelivings first three drafts then we had in the previous eleven, and things look reasonably positive for the last three (again, excluding top 6 picks).
  11. 3 points
    I think you two are expecting too much. Backlund was never projected to be a P/PG type player. He is a top 50 point produce in the NHL (among Cs) and for a guy picked late in the first round that's a win. In terms of his draft, he is 13 overall in points. The only 3 Cs with more points were all top 10 picks, and of them only Couture is a guy anyone would take over Backlund. Backlund is a huge success offensively and defensively given where he was drafted. The term "killed all offensive output" isn't accurate.
  12. 3 points
    I agree with everything you said, but wanted to add to the bolder. I believe that Tree has been building a culture through the draft for a while, and though most don’t agree with the picks that he has made. They all scream the same thing. Consistent, hard working players, who have been leaders on their teams and in the rooms, and play with their heart on their sleeve. It started with Mang and Ras, then Dube, now Pelltier and Zary, most recently Coronato. They are all very similar players and are creating a culture. He has now added some older vets who are cut from the same cloth to reinforce that, with Tanev and Coleman. I know that you can’t build an entire team out of these guys, but IMO he has had a plan for awhile.
  13. 2 points
    Tkachuk’s comments make me think he has every intention of signing his QO next year and walking right out the door as a UFA. Probably best To move him now if possible. He doesn’t sound like a team guy in this case.
  14. 2 points
    I think I have made my view clear with all the Eichel talk. M. Tkachuk is up for contract renewal and based off these comments, he will be looking for a raise. A combination of the brothers in the 8-10 mil range without a higher salary cap would handicap the Flames signing other players. For me, less than a tenth of the team should not make almost a quarter of the Salary cap. If Ottawa or St.Louis want to pull a Toronto or Edmonton, go ahead but I don’t want that in Calgary.
  15. 2 points
    Tarasenko ($2.5 retained) and Thomas for Tkachuk. I'm all in.. Thomas is a way better all-around player than Tkachuk. Hard RHC. Do it. We have LW. Thomas alone is better. Tarasenko must feel outright insulted. I'd like a star RW with a giant chip on his shoulder. One less one dimensional mouthpiece LW. For a high end RW and a budding, solid RHC. That's better than Eichel imho. If Army has to include Thomas to move Tara, I'll be pissed if it's for less than Tkalughead.
  16. 2 points
    Came acrross this: As many think a small major have a negative over tone to the Flames, I will just leave this here: In a article Dom Luszczyszyn of The Athletic wrote less than a month ago, he got responses from over 17,000 fans who ranked NHL front offices from best to worst. (from ‘Dom Luszczyszyn: 2021 NHL front office rankings: Fans weigh in on every team’ , The Athletic — 08/25/21). The Flames placed 24th out of 32 teams, and Luszczyszyn summed the reasoning up perfectly. “The Flames are at the same crossroads that all average teams are at when they realize they’re stuck in the mushy middle: go all-in or fold” Luszczyszyn wrote. “Pick a lane and either try to contend or try to rebuild. Doing neither just delays the inevitable and wastes time for everyone and that lack of vision is obviously going to be frustrating to a hungry fan base. Only 4 percent were more confident in this team now than they were last year, the lowest of any team in the league. Do something!”
  17. 2 points
    Ahhh, so those who disagree or vary in opinion should have no say
  18. 2 points
    What I think needs to happen is a new thread like, "The Hive of Doom", that you folks could hang out in. There are enough of you. Come tell us that you told us so occasionally. We'd love that.
  19. 2 points
    Ah but putting the blame on Tre is where imho I think you and JJ are wrong. The blame lies higher up!!
  20. 2 points
    I agree with lots of this, in particular that the club is in better shape now and moving forward than many others think. However, to build on that I think it depends on what the end goal of this is. If the end game is to have a team that is competitive, able to make the playoffs more often than not, and maybe get lucky and go on a run than I agree things are on the right path. However, if the end goal is to win a cup than I am very much in the camp that I don't see that happening with the path they are on because I don't see where the impact talent is going to come from. As much as we can say ok well go find a Point or a Bergeron (and without question they should be doing that anyway and I believe they are) I would suggest personally it is very unlikely to happen. But yes if it's being framed that the Flames are doomed so they might as well tank then I hear you and agree with that. I've said in other threads I think this team is built to be competitive for several more years but there is a big leap between being competitive and winning a cup. I don't see the path they are on closing that gap personally, but happy to be wrong there.
  21. 2 points
    That's precisely what I am doing. Flipping the script. The other side is presenting, "we have to tank for a high pick". I'm saying no we don't. Particularly with a ridiculous lottery system that doesn't guarantee a top 3 pick. Datsyuk was a 6th rder. Lidstrom a 3rd. Benn, Kucherov, Point et.al., we can call them outliers, but there are plenty of outliers if that's what we're calling it. Now we can pretend scouting is world's better now, unfortunately that's not the case. I know 2 scouts, 1 for the Wings, 1 for the Pens. Here's why there's always a consensus. It's an old boys club. They all gather together in 1 section of the arena to watch the same player(s), spill drinks and laugh it up like it's a family reunion. I've had this conversation with both. Their primary interest seems to be respect amongst their peers. Just like high school. So finding the hidden future NHLers is as easy as telling your scouts to sit elsewhere and not to follow the consensus. 1 scout I know actually took my advice and is stalwart. They all piggy-back off of each other. If I'm a GM, that's not what I'm paying for. This is how the Moritz Seider's go 6thoa when consensus is 6th best International player. Kid will be a monster NHLer. Building a solid foundation and adding to it smartly, I get that part. What I'm saying is you don't have to sell off every asset for picks and tank to accomplish that. Even Aho was a 2nd rder. It happens. A lot. Pelletier has the toolbox to be a Voracek-type, Zary a Couture. Our pipeline is looking the best it has in years. D is on the weak side, but we just graduated Andersson, Valimaki, potentially Mackey. But most are short on patience and out of time due to our old pipeline of Poirier's, Bouma's etc. My mission is to pull everyone back from the ledge. We aren't in as bad of shape as is being spewed all over. Both Pell and Zary are more than capable of transitioning to the next level. And yes, we do have a good GM. Too many want him fired. Impassioned, but misguided. We're only getting better. Now I just wait to prove my point. Talking heads are like scouts, they thrive on consensus as a group. One piles on, the rest follow suit. Let's all think for ourselves. We aren't as bad as a lot of people seem to be cheering for. Typical.
  22. 2 points
    I think as fans, we like to put simple explanations forward to keep things easy. "You need to have a first overall to win the cup" or "You need X number of ELCs" or "You need X caliber player as X,Y, and Z positions". I have done it. You have done it. Its how we set up context for an argument or discussion. But the reality is, you need the best players and the best team to win and there isn't a specific recipe to achieving that. That said, we all know that the best place to get the best players is the draft. The best way to get the best players in the draft is to draft higher and more often. And the best way to get the highest and most picks is to rebuild. I agree with you that the top SC teams had a lot of great players to complement the other great players they got in top spots of the drafts. But those teams still had the great players they got in the top spots of the draft. The issue with the Flames is we don't have the strong base the consistently great teams do. We don't have the top players at any position, and the two we have that can occasionally be in the conversation are at the least important position (LW). Could we find those players outside of a top 3 draft pick? Possibly. Its why people like me are advocating for Eichel. But its a lot harder. Some fans look at it like this. Are we good enough to be legitimate SC contenders with the base we have? No, then lets rebuild. Its that simple, and it leads to a lot of the arguments describe at the paragraph "The only way too ..." or "If we don't then terrible thing X,Y will occur". The owners don't look at it like that though. Playoffs and big name players is where you make your money. When you don't have those two things, then you rebuild to get those two things, but certainly not before. For coaches and GMs, if you can make the playoffs you might be the next 04 Flames, 06 Oilers, 20 Canadians, or even better 19 Blues. The GM and coaches aren't going to have a job through a rebuild.
  23. 2 points
    Eichel is better. A rough 'tier' of Cs looks something like: McDavid, MacKinnon, Matthews, Crosby, Draisaitl Bergeron, Eichel, Shcheifele, Barkov, Aho Point, Tavares, Malkin, O'Reilly, Pettersson, Kopitar, Backstrom, a few others Monahan along with a rather large list. I would put Lindholm here as well if he plays C. You can shuffle a few guys around the list I guess, but Eichel is levels above Monahan. Injury is a concern for Eichel for sure, but it is for Monahan as well. Monahan put up fewer points then Backlund last year, and that was his second season in decline. I certainly understand the concern about giving up futures, especially from a team that may need to rebuild or retool soon, but I look at it this way. In 2013 Feaster offered three first round picks, one the 6 OA, for MacKinnon. It took MacKinnon 5 years to really find his groove (bringing him roughly to the age Eichel is now). That trade would have amounted to Monahan, Klimchuk, and Poirier for MacKinnon. This is an opportunity to do the same to get an elite C, but this time one that is just entering his prime. Look at it another way. The Flames spend years in a rebuild and came out with Monahan, Gaudreau, Lindholm, Tkachuk, Hanafin, and a few D with potential. Gaudreau is the oldest guy on that last and he just turned 28. The Flames can spend 5 years rebuilding again hoping they get luckier then last time (and hope they get an Eichel caliber C). Or potentially they could add one of the elite Cs, possibly without even losing any of the core pieces listed above. A final way to look at it. The Flames likely will not rebuild. The ownership drug their feet as long as possible last time with a core much older and much less competitive then the one we have. We have already heard they are trying to extend Gaudreau, and we saw this summer that they didn't trade anyone. This time they have a new arena on the way. Even if a rebuild was the right and best chance, if the Flames won't do it then it doesn't matter. In which case fixing your biggest hole makes sense. I know the price for Eichel is 4 1st round picks or equivalent. But nobody is paying that which is why we are talkin about this in September. Whatever it comes too, the Flames should be making a serious offer for him. You have a bunch of high caliber D ready to break out, a couple of strong goalie options, and some value wingers you can use to further tweak the team if necessary. The Flames could use what they have and retool over the next 2 seasons and come out a contender. Are there risks? Sure. But a rebuild is at least as big of risk, and staying the course is a guarantee not to contend.
  24. 2 points
    This is the anti-pissing and moaning thread. When you get beside yourself, as a fan, about what the Flames are doing or not doing, take solace in the fact that they know more than you do. I'm excited to see what Vladar and Werner have to offer. Perfect age to acquire big goalies. I love the Zadorov add. Reggie mach 2. Stats don't take into account fear factor. He can take all the penalties he wants. Opposing fwds will always know the threat is real. Dude loves to hit, he's got a great attitude and personality. What I love most about Russians is that their interviews aren't choreographed, they're honest. Coleman, Pitlick, Lewis. Welcome and thanks in advance for joining us. I'm thankful. This is starting to look like a blue-collar team. Detroit being my other team, their cups weren't fancy superstars. They were blue-collar hard work. They call Datsyuk "The Magic Man", but the truth is he put the workboots on and wasn't afraid to get a little Satoshi Nakamoto on his shoes. That's what we're building here, finally. Work ethic. So before anyone wants to savage Lewis and Pitlick and all of that, "doesn't move the needle" crap, remember this. Detroit wins zero cups without Maltby-Draper-McCarty. We don't reach the finals without guys like Yelle and Nieminen and Nilson. Our D was laughable. We're on a very good path of improvement right now. Trading out the core was never going to fix anything. Fix the real problems, particularly a pathetic bottom 6 and floundering D. Good start. BT talked about changing the core. He might as well have just come out and said, "we're not protecting Gio". That was the reality. Get over it. So while many may not see the improvement, I guarantee, you're about to. In '04, adding Nieminen and Nilson seemed like "whatever" moves. So welcome everyone. Welcome to having a coach that is one of the best hockey minds in the business. Enjoy the ride. This season will be a blast. The funnest part is that all of the talking heads don't see it. So lets maybe not put much weight in what they think. They'll be wrong, as usual. We are all (unfinished) business.
  25. 2 points
    Lol yes but the point is it’s a contract space one way or the other, and if he’s going to the AHL why bother? We have enough of those anyway, just makes no sense it’s a bad sign no matter how you spin it…waste of money/cap space/contract space…he’s old and not NHL level anymore, there are/were better options.
  26. 2 points
    There are/were better options id the point…plus he’s 2 years removed from scoring 15 goals, back then he was 34 now he’s 36, that’s a lot of miles on the back end of a hockey player career, elite player can usually get more miles cause they were sooo much better that even when they degrade some they are still good…he’s no where elite average player at the best of his career, now he’s a fringe NHL player at best and we already have way too many of those now, the smart move would have been to NOT sign him and try Raz for a while on the 4th… this is the exact thing many fans have been complaining about for years, keeping your prospects down by brining in old player who lets be honest in Every case has NOT worked out Brewer, Neil, Jager…list goes on, one could argue Lucic too being as it was just a change of scenery for both Neil and Lucic…the only reason Lucic is still in the line up is he can’t be buried in the AHL, and he’s contract is next to buyout proof…which in my mind we went from bad with Neil, to worse with Lucic but that’s a whole other thing… if you look around the NHL how many 36 year olds are still playing? A few yes but In the vast majority of cases they were elite…example is Bergeron in Bos…he’s probably gonna retire next season, ans why? Cause he’s gone from an elite player to a good player, who’s also starting to decline from that level…now look at Richardson, he’s been a career 4th liner when he was younger, he’s 36, to be quite honest he aught to have retired 2 years ago…only here in Cgy do we see value in what a player used to be, not what they are now…in this case he’s a old guy trying to stay Ins young-mans game…so yes he is very much a “plug” now..not that that’s what I said, but if you like we can call him that, but realistically he’s just too old for hockey anymore and should never have been signed
  27. 2 points
    No battle for the back up. Vlader is your man this year. Mackey still to be signed and would not suprise me if they go back to Stone as the veteren dman. Up front they always seem to like to sign a few from camp tryouts. Treliving has been very quiet which probably means he is working on something!! Still not convinced he is done tinkering going into the season. 4 weeks to go and optimism is currently ruling pessimism!
  28. 2 points
    Agreed on the Monahan front TBC. I guess I valued Dvorak higher than most. And perhaps the potential in this upcoming draft makes that first rounder more valuable than most years. He’s just got a great contract price and term, he’s positive in the face-off dot, he can score and setup scoring, he’s defensively sound… to me he’s one of the rare 200 foot players that every team talks about but rarely ever finds. He’s good in so many areas of the ice. Plus, if Chucky is sticking around, I thought it would’ve been good to have his former linemate on the team (as a potential future linemate as well since the chemistry is already there). I may be in the minority, but I see Dvorak > JK. Though, Dvorak alone won’t replace both JK and Danault. MTL is in the toughest division as well - but I think they’re strong on the wings and in net. We’ll see how the D shakes out for them without Weber, though they did pickup Savard. They are a conundrum for this upcoming season to me. edit: I also hate to beat a dead horse (well, on second thought maybe not lol) but if the flames were targeting Eichel, Brouwer’s buyout is off the books after this season, and Lucic’s salary is off the books after next season. So, on a positive note, there will be some misallocated cap space coming back to the flames following an Eichel acquisition. On the flip side, we have to be careful not to overpay for the services Gaudreau or Chucky or Mony with that cap space, if that’s the plan. The Patrick idea is an interesting one for sure. I was just thinking that a Dvorak acquisition would be an excellent succession plan for Backlund, and we could move on from him.
  29. 2 points
    I'm not really sure why Reider makes any sense. JG-Mony-Coleman Tkachuk-Lindholm-Dube Mangia-Backlund-Pitlck Lucic-Ruzicka-Lewis Froese-Phillips This is where I see Dvorak would really change things. JG-Mony-Lindholm Tkachuk-Dvorak-Coleman/Dube Mangia-Backlund-Dube/Coleman Lucic-Lewis/Ruzicka-Pitlick Either way, don't see Reider mattering.
  30. 2 points
    I’m with you on this thought process, which is why I have wanted another Center like Dvorak. @cross16 mentions trading Phillips, and I think he could be a piece moving in that trade, similar to a garland replacement. It would also give up that top line with JG-Mony-Lindy, like you said and allow you to put Chucky-Dvorak with either Coleman or Mang. Giving you a pretty stacked third line of Coleman/Mang - Backs - Dube
  31. 2 points
    we have players here with the possibility of being stars.. First.. to be a star.. you\ve got to be in a position to win and showcase your skills for all to see.. We finally have a coach worthy of building a team rather than a roster of hockey players.. That alone will show us where we are and what we need going forward
  32. 2 points
    So let's broach that subject. Every owner wants to win now. They can't. Why are we going to the nth degree with this? There are 6 ways to skin a cat (so they tell me). The 1st way is the best. But 2-6 have been effective too. The Avs have MacKinnon and Rantanan, stellar dmen. See Tampa. See Florida. We aren't going to beat these teams adding a 1C. They have better ones. The only way we're winning now is making teams play our way, not theirs. Let's face it, we're in Sutter's hands. Our offseason moves have clearly been his. I think we're done for now. He wants to see what he has imho. Then I expect in-season moves. I'm highly doubting these are BT's moves, I'd say Sutter is training him to understand what a complete NHL roster looks like. I think we'll be good.
  33. 2 points
    So, does that mean McDavid, Draisatl, Barkov, Huberdeau, Marner, Matthews are on the same level as Gaudreau and Tkachuk? If we could trade Gaudreau and Tkachuk for any of those duos we'd do it in a heartbeat, but should we expect different results? I would say no, based on those players also having failures getting their own teams over the hump. Does it mean they can't either? No. I find sports funny, a guy like Ryan O'Reilly will now go down as a winner, to this point he's made it out of the first round once in his 12 year career, but because he went all the way that year he doesn't need another series win to lose that label. Joe Thornton has won a round most of the times he made the playoffs but likely won't be remembered for anything outside his regular season accomplishments.
  34. 2 points
    Ok see Ott makes sense they have a deep group of prospects and cap space unlike Cgy…they can afford the risk and makes sense to bring in timing is really good for Ott. Calgary needs to look at a full tear down very soon, this is what Cgy has never done properly and why we are always pretenders not contenders, where as Ott is gonna be a force in a few years with or without Eichel
  35. 2 points
    Was it MTL that gave Aho an offer? Too funny. Makes me love the Canes. Too much fun.
  36. 2 points
    Well if they could land Dvorak at a reasonable price I do like the options that bring so for the 2nd and 3rd lines: Tachuck/Dvorak/ Dube or Coleman Manji/Backlund/Dube or Coleman all things being equal, if all the players play to their abilities those are some really good 2nd and 3rd line combos behind Gaudreau/Monahan/Lindholm it could open up some room for the top line as any of the other two lines could be dangerous…which is really the big issue the past few seasons, shut done the first line and Cgy scoring is done…those lines all 3 could be very dangerous at any given time and would be hard to shut down all 3 I would think?
  37. 2 points
  38. 2 points
    I think we just need to get over Fox. If we propose a system that a drafted player must sign with that team, if players can't walk away from the team that drafted them, then teams shouldn't be allowed to walk away from players they drafted that they don't want to sign. Mitch Mattson is a draft pick I imagine the Flames have no interest in signing at this point, but if the Flames choose to pass does that mean no team can sign him for a year? Do they need toput in a rule that junior players who choose not to sign (rare but still exist ex. Gawdin) have to wait until a year after they age out of junior as well? Or are we changing the whole thing because of one player. A side note if Fox did sign, how much would it cost to keep him after next season? Highly unlikely in a world where Nurse makes 9.25 that Fox in the same province would take single digits.
  39. 2 points
    the slow starts are directly related to George Canyon lulling the Flames to sleep with his rotten singing.. Bring back Susan Smith.. Or Patti Smith or Iggy Pop and Jazz the place up!!! the entertainment factor at a Flames game is a non; factor
  40. 2 points
  41. 2 points
    I’m really enjoying this discussion, it’s a nice break from the Eichel talks, lol. First thing regarding the performance bonuses are in deed limited to 35+ and rookie contracts (which are still mandated through the CBA) there is very little wiggle room how those contracts are negotiated. And you can’t compare it to the NFL, because they have an entirely different cap structure. Secondly, I have been a supporter of BT and I’m mostly ok with the amateur scouts we have. I do agree that there has been some local kids that haven’t been as high on their list that should’ve been, and that should be questioned. But my concern as was mentioned in the Pro Scouting, who we only have Steve Pleau. I obviously don’t know enough about the inner workings of the team to point the finger at him specifically. But someone mentioned that Stevie Y and Sakic are good GMs because they’ve played at a high level and understand the dynamics of building good teams and targeting the correct players. I also agree Sutter will be able to correctly identify the right players for his team, but I think the organization really needs to consider better investing in their pro scouting so as to better equip the GM.
  42. 2 points
    Not too sure if the product cost and shipping will be less but you could try https://shop.international.nhl.com/. I usually use https://www.fanatics.com/ and the shipping is International Expedited 4-10 Days ($24.95)
  43. 2 points
    I don’t think most fans will every truly understand Backlund. He’s going to go down as one of the most misunderstood Flames of all time.
  44. 2 points
    And I don’t disagree but my counter would be a contender also wouldn’t be moving forward with Gio as their number one. I would argue the lack of a number one dman is more of an issue than who is going to replace Gio, within the context of being a number one. replacing Gio isn’t a huge issue for me. Not trying to belittle his play last year but I have a lot of confidence in who is left here to help fill that void.
  45. 1 point
    Lol yes but he also said this is part of how the negotiation game is played…it’s called posturing, which given the flat cap, it’s important to do…IMO, he’s just trying to keep the expectations high enough that the QO isn’t and bad as it could be…reality is, 9mil in a flat cap is tough to take on for any team..again, he’s trying to get and or keep max value…will he get it? Hard to say with a flat cap…the other question is will he get it in Cgy or elsewhere? Also hard to say…this COVID flat cap is a whole Economic era, teams are tightening their belts and players on down want less…so it’s kinda a wait and see thing, I think your gonna see guys like Tachuck and Gaudreau wait to sign extensions, it makes sense to see if things improve as the season moves on, they may opt for different contracts depending on how everything unfolds…maybe they go with a more back loaded contract because of the flat cap or maybe they go short term who knows? But I do get where the players are thinking, why sign now…especially long term if in 1-3 years things are better…signing long term now they are leaving a lot of money on the table…anyway, I’m kinda of the thinking that’s where a lot of this is coming from. as for guys needing to dig deep that is the kinda thing a captain or any leader should be saying…I’m ok with that. and I’m not sure why this is such a big surprise, the whole reason Matty got 7mil last go around was cause his daddy’s involvement…if I recall the same thing was said back then, it being a family business. I’m a huge fan of Tachuck, but if we could flip him for a better return and not hav daddy’s BS involved I’d be very ok with that…but again, has to be the right return like a 1st rounder and a top tier prospect… I think ther Thomas+ Tero Stl deal would be reasonable, though I’m not confident Tero is gonna be 100% ever again, he may still be a decent add…the real gem to the deal would be Thomas
  46. 1 point
    After missing the playoffs the past three seasons, the Flames traded Iginla kicking off a rebuild they had been procrastinating for far too long. The following off season the Flames draft Sean Monahan, and over the next 5 seasons the Flames continued to rebuild their core. This included signing their top prospect (Gaudreau), drafting Tkachuk, and adding both Lindholm and Hanafin in a trade. In the first season following the Lindholm / Hanafin acquisition the Flames won the Western Conference. Unfortunately, they were embarrassed in the first round of the playoffs. The following season they squeaked into the Playoffs, and were again ousted in the first round. Last season the Flames were 3 wins shy of making the playoffs in what was arguably the worst division in modern NHL history. Most fans, myself included, thought the Flames were in for a busy off season with changes to the core. However, the Flames instead opted to take one more kick at it with the current core, likely due to the influence of the new head coach Daryll Sutter. Instead of making sweeping changes Treliving instead focused on depth players in an effort to make the Flames more difficult to play against (and more Sutter like). Both Gaudreau, Tkachuk, and Mangiapane are due an extension next season, and Monahan the season after that. If the Flames falter this season do they continue to stay the course? Do they finally make some changes to the teams core? Or do we see the team enter into a full rebuild?
  47. 1 point
    The Flames can not be compared to the Oilers as we have not had a #1 draft chocie EVER. There is not guarnatee in either system of retool or rebuild. However, there is a commom ground. You have to have a GM that actually has a clue and a coach that can lead the way. We have the coach and he is decorated with 2 cups for it, Queniville, Trots, Cooper have won cups, These coaches can make teams better. However you can only go so far with a good coach, crap roster and meat head for GM. Edmontons issue have always been, Crap coaches, Worst GM's and top draft picks. What has worked is Tampa and CHI did was good draft picks, good coach and GM. LA won the cups with an #1 center, #1 Dman and a rock solid goaltending complimented by a coach that got players to buy in and a GM that understood this.
  48. 1 point
    I guess it's different for everyone but I think there has been quite a bit of change this off season, and I still think they want to make more. But going into next year: New captain new member of the top 6 (could be 2) New member of the top 4 D core (perhaps 2) Half of the bottom 6 turned over New coaching staff I don't think change is always new players from external too it's also elevating players within your organization. They are putting players like Mangiapane, Valimaki and Dube in a position to become more significant players in the organization. Time will tell if it's enough but I would contend that's certainly well above an average level of turnover for a team. Again, I get the desire for more but for more change that was going to have to come via the trade market. I don't know the behind the scenes and what was, or wasn't, being worked on but when I look at the deal that were made this off season it makes sense to me what the Flames appear quieter. Certainly not what you probably expected in May and I would agree with that too, but I also think it still beats what could have potentially happened.
  49. 1 point
    That's not very likely, the Flames look fine for the cap moving forward. End of the day if the Flames want to compete I think Mang needs to be treated as a core piece moving forward. Doesn't mean must keep him but it have to be a good trade offer. If the Sabres wanted him straight up for Eichel sure, but I wouldn't be doing Mang plus several other good pieces.
  50. 1 point
    The scoring is there. It may not have been there the last couple years but the core has already proven they can score alot, and win. Just gotta get the mojo back.
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