• Announcements

    • Kulstad

      Insults/Name-calling will not be tolerated   11/19/2016

      Tensions are high around this team and its fans.  It is very obvious that everyone here is passionate about the Flames, and has an opinion about what should be done to fix our unstable ship.  Stating your opinion is fine, it's exactly what these forums are for.   However, the name-calling and the insults are not required.   All insults/name-calling will be met with a zero-tolerance approach, regardless if you are a new person to the forums, or have been around since these forums began.   First-offenses will be met with a moderator-needs-to-approve-your-post for 3 days Second offenses will be met with a week-long suspension Third offenses will result in a perma-ban   If you have any questions regarding this policy, or would like to voice your concern about it, you are absolutely free to contact me directly.   We all love this team, and this game.  Let's continue to keep it civil around here.   --  Kulstad

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

jjgallow

Joni Ortio Watch

163 posts in this topic

After a rough start in the AHL, 21 year old Joni Ortio just had his best AHL game with a 35-save performance the other night:

http://theahl.com/stats/gamebygame.php?id=4090

IMHO opinion, Ortio was the the top goaltender of the 2011 World Juniors, and has as much a chance as any goaltender in our system of succeeding Kipper.

He might even have the best chance, due to his age. We keep expecting Kipper to decline, and here he's having his best season in years at the age of 35.

Ortio should be in his prime when Kipper approaches 40 years of age. With the way Kipper's playing we may not even Need a successor until then.

Great to see Ortio prove that he can be a top AHL goaltender. Let's see if he can actually Become a top AHL goaltender over the next year!

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 game doesn't prove anything. Let's see him put together a few good games before anything. The kid has been bad in most of his outings this year and 1 good game doesn't change that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 game doesn't prove anything. Let's see him put together a few good games before anything. The kid has been bad in most of his outings this year and 1 good game doesn't change that.

Agreed.

Ortio has some good raw talent he just need to harness it and adjust to a pro style/North American game and 1 game doens't show that. I would earmark him as Kipper's suceesor just yet, but he has that type of potential I think. Not as an Elite starter but certainly as a solid one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I tell you what guys...

http://stats.iihf.com/Hydra/236/IHM236000_85A_10_0.pdf

You put any one of us (myself included) behind the net for one of those AHL games, and we would prove All Sorts of things. Namely, that we are not cut out to be AHL goaltenders.

Ortio proved that he is capable of making AHL-level stops, for the first time in his career.

Does one game change his outlook with the Flames? Of course not. His outlook is largely based on his World Juniors Performance, and his play the other night was finally In Line with that projection.

The fact that he struggled in his first few AHL games...THAT is what doesn't prove anything. That's what you don't base your projections on.

Of course, we hope for a time that his projection will be based on his AHL play. No, one game will not be enough, but it's the only place anyone ever starts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I fall into the "He is in his 1st year over in North America". Backlund told us a bit how difficult it is at that age to learn a new language, learn a new life style, leave your friends and family behind. Because of that I put no expectations on him this year at all. It must take a huge amount of adjusting for him just to be here.

Early on he showed that he was playing his angles wrong. That is what a Goaltenders Coach is for.

I have not given up on him by any means but expected this season to be a wash. A good game is just a bonus at this stage.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I fall into the "He is in his 1st year over in North America". Backlund told us a bit how difficult it is at that age to learn a new language, learn a new life style, leave your friends and family behind. Because of that I put no expectations on him this year at all. It must take a huge amount of adjusting for him just to be here.

Early on he showed that he was playing his angles wrong. That is what a Goaltenders Coach is for.

I have not given up on him by any means but expected this season to be a wash. A good game is just a bonus at this stage.

I don't think anyone is giving up on him yet, just sayin lets not get too excited about a single game. I'd personally like to see Ortio go down to the ECHL and play on a regular basis to help him adapt to north american game a bit better. Then next year give him the backup role in Abby again and see how he does

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think anyone is giving up on him yet, just sayin lets not get too excited about a single game. I'd personally like to see Ortio go down to the ECHL and play on a regular basis to help him adapt to north american game a bit better. Then next year give him the backup role in Abby again and see how he does

I agree - he needs to play. If he isn't getting games in Abby, send him where he will get playing time.

As for him being the best goalie at the WJC last year, I agree, but that doesn't change the fact that he is several years, and a lot of development, away from being NHL-ready

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree - he needs to play. If he isn't getting games in Abby, send him where he will get playing time.

As for him being the best goalie at the WJC last year, I agree, but that doesn't change the fact that he is several years, and a lot of development, away from being NHL-ready

I think the all-star team was correct in naming Jack Campell the top goaltender at the 2011 world juniors, but people also seem to overrate being the best goaltender at the World Juniors. That list includes alot of nobodies and alot of mediocre goaltenders.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the all-star team was correct in naming Jack Campell the top goaltender at the 2011 world juniors, but people also seem to overrate being the best goaltender at the World Juniors. That list includes alot of nobodies and alot of mediocre goaltenders.

Agree on both counts, Jack Campbell was hands down the best goalie at the World Juniors last year. Ortio was good, but not fantastic IMO.

Just to name a few, Jimmy Waite, Mike Dunham, Stephane Fiset, Marek Schwarz all top goalies at the WJC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well...it looks like there's a lot of opinions in those world juniors.

I would have gone with Ortio, hands down. The people who's opinion matters went with Benjamin Conz:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_World_Junior_Ice_Hockey_Championships

As for Campbell...I have a real hard time giving the guy the nod when they almost ran out of players trying to find someone he could make a save against:

Campbell and Ortio had almost identical stats. Campbell's save percentage was slightly better, and Ortio was the only one of the two to get a shutout.

But, you'll never convince me that Campbell faced the same kind of shots that Ortio did.

Just look at this USA Finland matchup: The US totally controlled the game, and if you compare the quality of the goals, well...it's subjective but I call Ortio the better goaltender hands down.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just to name a few, Jimmy Waite, Mike Dunham, Stephane Fiset, Marek Schwarz all top goalies at the WJC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IIHF_World_Under_20_Championship_Directorate_award_winners

Dominek Hasek,

Craig Billington,

Manny Legace,

Roberto Luongo,

Rick Dipietro,

Kari Lehtonen,

Carey Price,

Steve Mason

...

I have a real hard time believing that it's a bad thing to be a top goaltender in the world juniors. That goes for any other list that Dominek Hasek is on...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_IIHF_World_Under_20_Championship_Directorate_award_winners

Dominek Hasek,

Craig Billington,

Manny Legace,

Roberto Luongo,

Rick Dipietro,

Kari Lehtonen,

Carey Price,

Steve Mason

...

I have a real hard time believing that it's a bad thing to be a top goaltender in the world juniors. That goes for any other list that Dominek Hasek is on...

It's not a bad thing to be named top goalie, but that doesn't guarantee NHL success. Ortio has some great athleticism and his size is a plus, but the finer details of his game are pretty rough and unpolished.

Show some support, but don't take everything into account, and ALWAYS take everything with a grain of salt. I thought he was overall solid during the tourney, but at no time did I think he was the top goalie.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a real hard time believing that it's a bad thing to be a top goaltender in the world juniors. That goes for any other list that Dominek Hasek is on...

no one said it was a bad thing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

no one said it was a bad thing

Likewise, nobody said Jack Campbell wasn't the best goalie in the 2011 world juniors.

But, we were discussing the 2010 world juniors.

I'd still give it to Ortio, even though he didn't win the award.

Ortio just rescued Danny Taylor last night actually, and was by far the better goaltender of the two, on a night that the Heat looked very tired (end of back to back games).

Danny is having his best season ever, but he'll have to because Ortio will be gunning for that starting position in short order.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Likewise, nobody said Jack Campbell wasn't the best goalie in the 2011 world juniors.

But, we were discussing the 2010 world juniors.

I'd still give it to Ortio, even though he didn't win the award.

Ortio just rescued Danny Taylor last night actually, and was by far the better goaltender of the two, on a night that the Heat looked very tired (end of back to back games).

Danny is having his best season ever, but he'll have to because Ortio will be gunning for that starting position in short order.

i don't know why i thought it was last years

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i don't know why i thought it was last years

lol...i don't know why i started arguing with you before I read your post properly and realized you were talking about 2011...

oh well :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

as per abbotsfordheat.com Ortio has been assigned to a Finnish team

It sounds like that was the plan before Irving got called up. Good to see. He will hopefully get some ice time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great news for Ortio.

Now I see why there's all the speculation about the Flames acquiring a goaltender.

Or, is Karlsson simply on the mend?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great news for Ortio.

Now I see why there's all the speculation about the Flames acquiring a goaltender.

Or, is Karlsson simply on the mend?

the only speculation on here about the flames and goaltending started with me, but it sounds like Karlsson may be close

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Campbell hasn't impressed me. Windsor has had some good teams. Now he's a greyhound, one of the worst teams in the league.

The U.S. couldn't put up the least of a fight for a medal.

Campbell is riding the wave of a dominant Windsor Spitfire team, those days are gone.

The hype remains. He's a sound goalie. Special? No.

Ortio has the same shot as Campbell at making it, imho.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just my two cents here ...

I think it's a mistake to send Joni back to Finland. We drafted him, and if we want to keep him and develop him, time in NA is better than Europe. That being said, here where I see the current depth in goal:

Kipper - around for a few more years

Karlsson - contract year

Irving - contract year

Taylor - tryout contract with Abbotsford

Ortio - Europe

Ramo - Europe

This is how I see it next year:

Kipper - #1

Irving - #2

Ramo - Abby #1

Ortio - Abby #2

Someone said it earlier, and I'll agree; Ortio would be better served in the ECHL than Europe. I don't see it a step back in development or a vote of non-confidence, he needs to get used to the smaller ice. That more than anything would help his game get on track.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just my two cents here ...

I think it's a mistake to send Joni back to Finland. We drafted him, and if we want to keep him and develop him, time in NA is better than Europe.

why?

curious why we think sending him to the team that developed Kipper is bad for his development:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TPS_(ice_hockey)#Current_roster

"NHL players from TPS include Saku Koivu, Mikko Koivu, Miikka Kiprusoff, Sami Salo, Niko Kapanen, Jere Lehtinen, Antero Niittymäki and Lauri Korpikoski."

p.s...Kipper developed there until his was 23 years old. Ortio is 20.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.