Sign in with your NHL account:
  • Submit
  • Or
  • Sign in with Google

Jump to content


Photo

Heat Moving?


  • Please log in to reply
56 replies to this topic

#21 PokernHockey

PokernHockey

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 574 posts

Posted 03 April 2013 - 05:14 PM

Why would the flames possibly move?  They have a sweetheart deal.  From the Flames perspective, why do we care if the Nucks would sell more seats.  Very few AHL teams do well, the heat are close to home and are guaranteed to make money.  If I was King the only way I would move is if the Nucks, Abbotsford, or the new city promised to meet or beat the current $5million profit guarantee. After the 10 year agreement runs out they will be gone though I am sure.



#22 geos

geos

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,291 posts

Posted 03 April 2013 - 09:30 PM

I think they should build an arena in Airdrie and move the farm team there.

 

Great idea. Does any city in North America have 3 hockey teams though (Flames, Heat, Hitmen)? That's a lot for one market. I know Toronto has several teams within the GTA (Leafs, Marlies, Battalion, Steelheads, Colts, etc.), but that's also 7 million population market. 

 

Why would the flames possibly move?  They have a sweetheart deal.  

 

The Canucks may buy out that deal in order to get their team closer. The financial benefits could still sit with the Flames/Heat.



#23 PokernHockey

PokernHockey

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 574 posts

Posted 03 April 2013 - 10:39 PM

he Canucks may buy out that deal in order to get their team closer. The financial benefits could still sit with the Flames/Heat.

 

that is along the lines of what I meant by this:

 

If I was King the only way I would move is if the Nucks, Abbotsford, or the new city promised to meet or beat the current $5million profit guarantee.



#24 kehatch

kehatch

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • PipPipPip
  • 5,664 posts

Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:55 PM

Why would the flames possibly move?  They have a sweetheart deal.  From the Flames perspective, why do we care if the Nucks would sell more seats.  Very few AHL teams do well, the heat are close to home and are guaranteed to make money.  If I was King the only way I would move is if the Nucks, Abbotsford, or the new city promised to meet or beat the current $5million profit guarantee. After the 10 year agreement runs out they will be gone though I am sure.

 

As both you and geo said I think there is a financial deal to be made.  I think the Flames want to be successful in their AHL club.  I also think they honestly care about the fans.  They are a organization that has consistently done the classy thing.  And keeping a Canucks team out of Abbotsford when it makes sense for the sponsors, city, arena, and fans isn't the type of thing they would do if there were other options.

 

I don't think they are going to eat a bunch of cash or put the Heat in jeopardy to do it.  But I am sure they are having conversations and are perceptive to finding a deal that works.   



#25 andymo

andymo

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 522 posts

Posted 05 April 2013 - 08:50 PM

One location that is never mentioned is Calgary! I am not sure if there is any reason why the Heat can't replace the Hitmen. It would super convenient for call ups and they would be guaranteed lots of support. There is probably something glaringly obvious I am missing but it sounds perfect to me.



#26 s4xon

s4xon

    Rebuilder's Union

  • Moderators
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,032 posts
  • LocationInside enemy lines.

Posted 05 April 2013 - 09:48 PM

One location that is never mentioned is Calgary! I am not sure if there is any reason why the Heat can't replace the Hitmen. It would super convenient for call ups and they would be guaranteed lots of support. There is probably something glaringly obvious I am missing but it sounds perfect to me.

 

The Calgary Hitmen are an established WHL team.  Why would they tear down an established franchise for the Heat which is an AHL team?  Plus the Flames owns both.



#27 ucwm

ucwm

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 33 posts

Posted 06 April 2013 - 07:17 AM

How bout move them to Calgary.  Flames get a new arena to play in down the road so the heat could play in the Dome. 

 

I think they should build an arena in Airdrie and move the farm team there.



#28 geos

geos

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,291 posts

Posted 06 April 2013 - 08:54 AM

No way does the Dome stand if a new arena is built. Can't be supported, an AHL team can't justify a 17,000+ seat arena with no secondary events.



#29 PokernHockey

PokernHockey

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 574 posts

Posted 07 April 2013 - 05:26 PM

One location that is never mentioned is Calgary! I am not sure if there is any reason why the Heat can't replace the Hitmen. It would super convenient for call ups and they would be guaranteed lots of support. There is probably something glaringly obvious I am missing but it sounds perfect to me.

 

How bout move them to Calgary.  Flames get a new arena to play in down the road so the heat could play in the Dome. 


The only team [to my knowledge] that hosts their own farm team in the same city is Toronto.  This year the Marlies are 9th in league attendance.  If a huge, hockey mad city with one of the most devoted fan basis can only attract 6600 fans a night it is unlikely that Calgary, which is much smaller, and already has a WHL team and a NHL team could support all three. (Toronto does not have an OHL team - although there are teams within a short drive outside of the City).

the Hitman and Flames, while they compete, due to the price difference are targeted to different demographics.  The Heat and Hitman would likely directly compete due to price so ticket sales to one would likely cannibalize the other to an extremely high degree.  Both the AHL and WHL position their product as a variation of "see tomorrows stars today.  bring your family without breaking the bank."

I think Lethbridge or Red Deer is likely the closest you could be without directly cannibalizing Flames/Hitman sales, although I doubt either are large enough to support both a WHL team and an AHL team so you likely run into the same problem as you would with the Hitman - although since Calgary doesn't own either of those WHL teams it would affect them less. Your also not likely to get as good of a deal from those cities as they currently have/could get in other markets that don't currently have a professional or Jr team.

Abbotsford is a short flight away, and the arguments of having them in Calgary and Abbotsford is basically the same (but even less travel to get to the big club - who cares. it is a 2 hour flight and half the time they would be called up while the flames are on the road so they would be traveling to get their anyway).  However Calgary does not solve the problem with being in Abbotsford (lots of travel to games) while also likely creating the new problem of hurting the organization financially.  IMO if they move from Abbostford it should be because they decide that the travel issue needs to be addressed which would take them east.



#30 The_People1

The_People1

    Advanced Member

  • Administrators
  • 11,365 posts

Posted 08 April 2013 - 12:28 PM


The only team [to my knowledge] that hosts their own farm team in the same city is Toronto.  This year the Marlies are 9th in league attendance.  If a huge, hockey mad city with one of the most devoted fan basis can only attract 6600 fans a night it is unlikely that Calgary, which is much smaller, and already has a WHL team and a NHL team could support all three. (Toronto does not have an OHL team - although there are teams within a short drive outside of the City).

the Hitman and Flames, while they compete, due to the price difference are targeted to different demographics.  The Heat and Hitman would likely directly compete due to price so ticket sales to one would likely cannibalize the other to an extremely high degree.  Both the AHL and WHL position their product as a variation of "see tomorrows stars today.  bring your family without breaking the bank."

I think Lethbridge or Red Deer is likely the closest you could be without directly cannibalizing Flames/Hitman sales, although I doubt either are large enough to support both a WHL team and an AHL team so you likely run into the same problem as you would with the Hitman - although since Calgary doesn't own either of those WHL teams it would affect them less. Your also not likely to get as good of a deal from those cities as they currently have/could get in other markets that don't currently have a professional or Jr team.

Abbotsford is a short flight away, and the arguments of having them in Calgary and Abbotsford is basically the same (but even less travel to get to the big club - who cares. it is a 2 hour flight and half the time they would be called up while the flames are on the road so they would be traveling to get their anyway).  However Calgary does not solve the problem with being in Abbotsford (lots of travel to games) while also likely creating the new problem of hurting the organization financially.  IMO if they move from Abbostford it should be because they decide that the travel issue needs to be addressed which would take them east.

 

I really think Airdrie is a good location.  It's close to Calgary's International Airport.  It's 15-minute drive North of Calgary so Flames fans in Calgary can go cheer on the Baby Flames when the Flames are out of town.  The community itself is thriving with 42,000+ living there and numerous new communities being built (Abbotsford has 170,000 metro).  But if you consider Calgary's northern communities like Panorama, Skyview Ranch, etc., then the potential market is much bigger.

 

They need to build an arena that can seat about 7,000 and they should be good (Abbotsford arena seats 7,000).  Lots of Calgarians will drive up there to watch games and bring in added revenue to Airdrie.  Build it just North of CrossIron Mills.



#31 cannedice99

cannedice99

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,228 posts
  • LocationHeat Territory

Posted 09 April 2013 - 01:31 PM

I really don't think Airdrie is viable.  This exact situation here in BC occured whent he Heat moved in.  There was a massive shuffle of teams in 3 different leagues.  I'll state it in point form (easier for me):

 

- Heat begin play.  Chilliwack Bruins (WHL) experience declining season ticket sales.

- Bruins move after +/-2 years to Victoria and become the Royals (WHL).

- Victoria Salmon Kings (ECHL) fold up their tents to allow the Royals in.

- Langley Chiefs (BCHL) are renamed the Rivermen so the Quesnel Millionaires (BCHL) can move to Chilliwack and keep the Chiefs name.

 

I see this affecting not only the Hitmen, but also the Red Deer Rebels, and numerous other AJHL franchises.



#32 DirtyDeeds

DirtyDeeds

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 7,258 posts

Posted 09 April 2013 - 02:18 PM

I really think Airdrie is a good location.  It's close to Calgary's International Airport.  It's 15-minute drive North of Calgary so Flames fans in Calgary can go cheer on the Baby Flames when the Flames are out of town.  The community itself is thriving with 42,000+ living there and numerous new communities being built (Abbotsford has 170,000 metro).  But if you consider Calgary's northern communities like Panorama, Skyview Ranch, etc., then the potential market is much bigger.

 

They need to build an arena that can seat about 7,000 and they should be good (Abbotsford arena seats 7,000).  Lots of Calgarians will drive up there to watch games and bring in added revenue to Airdrie.  Build it just North of CrossIron Mills.

So do you really think that having the Flames now build 2 arenas in the Greater Calgary area is a good idea just to accomodate the Vancouver Canucks farm team?

 

Why should we help them so they can get the benefit of having a closer farm team when we went through all the trouble of setting up that package for us?

 

You can pretty much bet your house that Abbosford went to Vancouver first and got blow away before approaching us to put in a tenant hockey club.



#33 The_People1

The_People1

    Advanced Member

  • Administrators
  • 11,365 posts

Posted 09 April 2013 - 02:23 PM

I really don't think Airdrie is viable.  This exact situation here in BC occured whent he Heat moved in.  There was a massive shuffle of teams in 3 different leagues.  I'll state it in point form (easier for me):

 

- Heat begin play.  Chilliwack Bruins (WHL) experience declining season ticket sales.

- Bruins move after +/-2 years to Victoria and become the Royals (WHL).

- Victoria Salmon Kings (ECHL) fold up their tents to allow the Royals in.

- Langley Chiefs (BCHL) are renamed the Rivermen so the Quesnel Millionaires (BCHL) can move to Chilliwack and keep the Chiefs name.

 

I see this affecting not only the Hitmen, but also the Red Deer Rebels, and numerous other AJHL franchises.

 

The pros outweigh the cons, like for example, calling a player up to the parent club is literally a phone call away and the player drives to the Saddledome instead of Airdrie.  Plus, the further East a team can be, the cheaper the travel costs.



So do you really think that having the Flames now build 2 arenas in the Greater Calgary area is a good idea just to accomodate the Vancouver Canucks farm team?

 

Why should we help them so they can get the benefit of having a closer farm team when we went through all the trouble of setting up that package for us?

 

You can pretty much bet your house that Abbosford went to Vancouver first and got blow away before approaching us to put in a tenant hockey club.

 

What does this have to do with the Vancouver Canucks farm team?



#34 DirtyDeeds

DirtyDeeds

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 7,258 posts

Posted 09 April 2013 - 02:32 PM

The pros outweigh the cons, like for example, calling a player up to the parent club is literally a phone call away and the player drives to the Saddledome instead of Airdrie.  Plus, the further East a team can be, the cheaper the travel costs.



 

What does this have to do with the Vancouver Canucks farm team?

The only way that the Heat would move here, is if the Canucks wanted the Abbostford arena for their farm team and wanted to offer incentive for the Heat to move out.

 

Edit: On a side note the farm(Abbostford) is all of a 90 minute flight from Calgary now. Hardly a game changing difference from the 30 minute drive from Airdrie to the Dome.

 

We have a fairly lengthy contract now and this whole thread is talking that the reason the Heat might be moving is because the Canucks might be looking to move their farm team in to Abbostford.

 

http://thecanuckway....heir-farm-team/

http://bc.ctvnews.ca...ermen-1.1219772

http://prohockeytalk...ove-disgusting/

http://thecanuckway....rd-next-season/

http://www.abbotsfor...2322/story.html

http://www.abbotsfor...3956/story.html

http://www.theprovin...4738/story.html

http://www.pjstar.co...uation-is-fluid

http://www.vancouver...4111/story.html



#35 The_People1

The_People1

    Advanced Member

  • Administrators
  • 11,365 posts

Posted 09 April 2013 - 02:44 PM

The only way that the Haat would move here, is if the Canucks wanted the Abbostford arena for their farm team and wanted to offer incentive for the Heat to move out.

 

We have a fairly lengthy contract now and this whole thread is talking that the reason the Heat might be moving is because the Canucks might be looking to move their farm team in to Abbostford.

 

http://thecanuckway....heir-farm-team/

http://bc.ctvnews.ca...ermen-1.1219772

http://prohockeytalk...ove-disgusting/

http://thecanuckway....rd-next-season/

http://www.abbotsfor...2322/story.html

http://www.abbotsfor...3956/story.html

http://www.theprovin...4738/story.html

http://www.pjstar.co...uation-is-fluid

http://www.vancouver...4111/story.html

 

I was just coming from the perspective that a move to Airdrie would benefit the Flames, irrelevant of whether the Canucks benefit too.



#36 cannedice99

cannedice99

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,228 posts
  • LocationHeat Territory

Posted 24 April 2013 - 07:46 AM

All I see from the above links is rumours.  But here's a fact;  the Heat will not be moving this year.

 

http://t.co/5rIvN0lM7A



#37 crazyhockeyguy

crazyhockeyguy

    Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPip
  • 11 posts

Posted 30 April 2013 - 06:36 PM

If they move the Heat anywhere they should put them in Saskatoon close proximity and a good hockey market wanting a Pro team.



#38 cross16

cross16

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 12,300 posts
  • LocationCalgary

Posted 05 May 2013 - 10:56 AM

I think if, or what sounds like when at this point, the Flames move their AHL team I think their proximity to Calgary won't be highest on the list in terms of locations. I've heard Ken King talk about this but the travel in Abbotsford is horrendous and it sound like they are starting to become pretty concerned about just how much travel is involved and its even limiting their practice time. I think location and travel would be really important in deciding that and for me that would likely mean a team located in the States.



#39 jjgallow

jjgallow

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,546 posts

Posted 12 May 2013 - 02:12 AM

I wonder if Seattle will get an AHL team....maybe the Heat, or the Oilers?



#40 cannedice99

cannedice99

    Advanced Member

  • SeniorMembers
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,228 posts
  • LocationHeat Territory

Posted 14 May 2013 - 07:33 AM

http://www.calgaryhe...9506/story.html

 

Basically the Canucks have 30 days to find a home for the Peoria Rivermen for next year.  Since Abby's out of the question, maybe Seattle could fill in.  I personally think it's high time the AHL moves more West.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users