Jump to content
The Official Site of the Calgary Flames

Recommended Posts

If push comes to shove I am sure the NHL wouldn't have to honour the NMC or NTC. The issue is that pushing and shoving takes time and they need things worked out by June.

If the PA chooses to dispute this they could derail the entire thing. Which makes it likely the NHL will compromise in the interest of moving things along.

Besides, the PA does have a lot of power. They managed to derail the first attempt at conference alignment for example and pushed that back by a year.

Why would the players assoc want to derail the whole thing over some contract clause dispute? The expansion is increasing their size by adding more jobs into the hockey job market and increasing revenues from the extra/new players.

 

The player association has to have a pro stance for growth, how can they not?

 

I don't see derailing the expansion process as an option. Any complaints about NMC's or NTC's would have to be from a different method than derailing the greater picture. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ignoring tonight's amazing play by him, what do people think of trying to get Neuvirth out of Philly? I've been following him for a while (Washington is my second team after Calgary). and outside of his time with the Sabres he's got pretty respectable stats (Hell, even with them, his GAA was higher, but he had above-average Sv% still). Only a couple seasons where he has had 1a/1b starts in games played (2 with Washington and then this year in Philly), but he definitely has potential, and has 180 Games started (200) games played, so a decent sample size.

He has a year left & I think Hex kinda wants to hold onto him. The Flyers prospect pool in goal isn't deep.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If push comes to shove I am sure the NHL wouldn't have to honour the NMC or NTC. The issue is that pushing and shoving takes time and they need things worked out by June.

If the PA chooses to dispute this they could derail the entire thing. Which makes it likely the NHL will compromise in the interest of moving things along.

Besides, the PA does have a lot of power. They managed to derail the first attempt at conference alignment for example and pushed that back by a year.

I can see the NHLPA pushing for honoring both. With a MNC clause they have a chance but NTCs by definition only offer the player to list teams he can't be traded to. Since the expansion team(s) don't yet exist &  didn't   @ contract signing it/they obviously couldn't be on anyone's no trade list.

A smart agent might have anticipated expansion recently but with players needing to be 26 to get either clause & most clauses belonging to older players the pool affected is bound to be small. If pushed to hard it would result in the PA making those clauses harder for even deserving players to get.

 

With the average age of players getting younger the next CBA negotiations are apt to see the PA push for more for the youth. That could be self defeating as it's the EL contracts that have brought the age down. If not for the cheap contracts teams would be more apt to let the players grow & mature in the CHL before they need to be paid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why would the players assoc want to derail the whole thing over some contract clause dispute? The expansion is increasing their size by adding more jobs into the hockey job market and increasing revenues from the extra/new players.

The player association has to have a pro stance for growth, how can they not?

I don't see derailing the expansion process as an option. Any complaints about NMC's or NTC's would have to be from a different method than derailing the greater picture.

They are responsible for the player base first. Plus the word is they are going to push for at least NMC to be honoured.

I am sure they want expansion. But that doesn't mean they won't use the leverage they have to protect their players.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What about Niklas Backstrom? Is he absolutely off the slate with Calgary? He would make a great backup, IMO. If he isn't a hot item, maybe he would stay for le$$; maybe his past injury/s will work in Calgary'$ favor.

 

Even Backstrom knows he has most likely played his last game in the NHL, and if that's the case, he went out in style...   He will not be returning with the Flames even as a backup, and I doubt if any other NHL team picks him up either...

 

I wouldn't mind the Flames giving him a trial season as a goalie coach if he is interested though...   Either way, I hope that Sigalet is out...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Even Backstrom knows he has most likely played his last game in the NHL, and if that's the case, he went out in style...   He will not be returning with the Flames even as a backup, and I doubt if any other NHL team picks him up either...

 

I wouldn't mind the Flames giving him a trial season as a goalie coach if he is interested though...   Either way, I hope that Sigalet is out...

 

We owe Backstrom nothing.  We honored his trade terms and actually surpassed that by letting him finish his career at his long term home.  

 

If we are looking for a goalie coach, I would look for the best in the world.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We owe Backstrom nothing.  We honored his trade terms and actually surpassed that by letting him finish his career at his long term home.  

 

If we are looking for a goalie coach, I would look for the best in the world.  

 

Backstrom certainly has the experience and qualifications.  He has lived and breathed the GT'ing position his whole life, not sure who would be more qualified.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Backstrom certainly has the experience and qualifications.  He has lived and breathed the GT'ing position his whole life, not sure who would be more qualified.

 

An actual goalie coach.... :lol:

 

Just because the guy had game doesn't mean he can evaluate and teach.  I wouldn't want Kipper as a goalie coach either, unless he was a great teacher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

An actual goalie coach.... :lol:

 

Just because the guy had game doesn't mean he can evaluate and teach.  I wouldn't want Kipper as a goalie coach either, unless he was a great teacher.

 

I’m not saying he would be the best option available, but certainly one to consider.  He has been guarding and blocking a piece of real-estate that measures 72” x 48” for 30 yrs againt the best shooters in the world.  I’m sure he would have plenty of pointers and information to share.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Backstrom definitely won't  play in the NHL again. 

 

If he wanted to he might be able to do like Hiller did and find a job somewhere else for a few seasons before retiring. 

 

Even if he hangs up the skates professionally, 

 

a ) Does he WANT to coach?

 

b ) CAN he coach? 

 

 

If both of those are yes's I'm open to giving him a look. If either is a no....run away!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ortio is too inexperienced and unproven to be considered a 1A or starter. Ramo is going to be too expensive to be slotted as 1B or backup.

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ramo as the 1A or starter (in approximate order):

Andersen, Bishop, Neuvirth, Allen, Fleury, Varlamov, Elliott, Mason, Schneider, Murray, Raanta, Reimer, Bernier, Halak, Enroth, Darling, Smith, Kuemper, Anderson

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ortio as the 1B or backup (in approximate order):

Murray, Neuvirth, Raanta, Allen, Kuemper, Enroth

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ortio is too inexperienced and unproven to be considered a 1A or starter. Ramo is going to be too expensive to be slotted as 1B or backup.

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ramo as the 1A or starter (in approximate order):

Andersen, Bishop, Neuvirth, Allen, Fleury, Varlamov, Elliott, Mason, Schneider, Murray, Raanta, Reimer, Bernier, Halak, Enroth, Darling, Smith, Kuemper, Anderson

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ortio as the 1B or backup (in approximate order):

Murray, Neuvirth, Raanta, Allen, Kuemper, Enroth

 

If it were somehow possible, I would like one of Andersen and one of Murray, please.

 

Available for trade would be....

Klimchuk, Poirier, Hickey, Agostino, Arnold, Kulak, Ortio, 2016 Dallas Pick, 2017 1st rounder.....

 

Roster players available.....

Colborne, Jooris, Engelland, Stajan, Wideman, Bouma.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Much though I don't like giving up on Ortio as I think he'll develop into a good NHLer at some level, a duo of Andersen and Murray would definitely make us not just playoff competitive, but win a round or two competitive. 

 

#pipedreams or should i say #betweenthepipesdreams

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Much though I don't like giving up on Ortio as I think he'll develop into a good NHLer at some level, a duo of Andersen and Murray would definitely make us not just playoff competitive, but win a round or two competitive.

#pipedreams or should i say #betweenthepipesdreams

That would be awesome but obviously not realistic. Starting the season with something like Varlamov and Raanta could be realistic though. Or even Varlamov and Ortio if the Flames still see something in him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like I said. Pipe Dream. 

 

Personally I'd like to see commitment to the guys who come up through our system. To my mind that means keeping Ortio on a 1 year deal. (unless there was some clearly amazing deal like the hypothetical above)

 

Bring in a starter and let Ortio compete. Let him have the 1 year contract. If he flubs then he goes. but he had the chance. If he's a backup, then he's proven himself a backup. If he can step up to play as a tandem player or challenge for starter's games, then more power to him. 

 

I think if the team shows that anyone who can play their way onto the NHL roster will be given the chance to take the best job they're capable of, that the players in our system will work harder to take that chance.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Much though I don't like giving up on Ortio as I think he'll develop into a good NHLer at some level, a duo of Andersen and Murray would definitely make us not just playoff competitive, but win a round or two competitive. 

 

#pipedreams or should i say #betweenthepipesdreams

 

Getting both would be amazing.  :D  And I like what you did there with the hashtag - brilliant! :lol:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ortio is too inexperienced and unproven to be considered a 1A or starter. Ramo is going to be too expensive to be slotted as 1B or backup.

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ramo as the 1A or starter (in approximate order):

Andersen, Bishop, Neuvirth, Allen, Fleury, Varlamov, Elliott, Mason, Schneider, Murray, Raanta, Reimer, Bernier, Halak, Enroth, Darling, Smith, Kuemper, Anderson

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ortio as the 1B or backup (in approximate order):

Murray, Neuvirth, Raanta, Allen, Kuemper, Enroth

Pardon my ignorance but is RFA like an arbitration year ? if the team doesn't come to terms with a RFA do they retain 1 year of rights at an arbitrated figure ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like I said. Pipe Dream. 

 

Personally I'd like to see commitment to the guys who come up through our system. To my mind that means keeping Ortio on a 1 year deal. (unless there was some clearly amazing deal like the hypothetical above)

 

Bring in a starter and let Ortio compete. Let him have the 1 year contract. If he flubs then he goes. but he had the chance. If he's a backup, then he's proven himself a backup. If he can step up to play as a tandem player or challenge for starter's games, then more power to him. 

 

I think if the team shows that anyone who can play their way onto the NHL roster will be given the chance to take the best job they're capable of, that the players in our system will work harder to take that chance.

I could sure go along with that thinking while there was still very good potential coming up the system. That thinking doesn't get in the way of absolutely needing to place a proven power in net. Regular season games are where the rubber hits the road (or in this case the pipe). Lose 5 games and your in trouble again. :angry:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think people are way too hard here on Jordan Sigalet. The Flames goal tending, IMO and I think the eyes of most, overachieved last year. Ramo had a tough start but after working with Sigalet played the best hockey of his career IMO. Ortio was basically wrirten off but managed to come back and looked like an NHL goalie. Hiller wasn't very good of course, but I think HIller was trending down last season and at 33 when he wasn't all that good to begin with? Can't blame a coach for someone losing their game. 

 

Hard to be a good coach when you aren't working with very good talent. Outside of HIller, I think Sigalet's body of work is pretty good. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think people are way too hard here on Jordan Sigalet. The Flames goal tending, IMO and I think the eyes of most, overachieved last year. Ramo had a tough start but after working with Sigalet played the best hockey of his career IMO. Ortio was basically wrirten off but managed to come back and looked like an NHL goalie. Hiller wasn't very good of course, but we are going to play a goalie goalie for a 33 year goalie losing his game?

 

Hard to be a good coach when you aren't working with very good talent. Outside of HIller, I think Sigalet's body of work is pretty good. 

People tend to forget these players don't make it to the NHL door by mistake.

Players need coaches to emphasize the fundamentals that make them have strong performances and tweak an enhancement in any goalie's style to make them better. I think the great ones have great anticipation and play reading abilities which make them a cut above most.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pardon my ignorance but is RFA like an arbitration year ? if the team doesn't come to terms with a RFA do they retain 1 year of rights at an arbitrated figure ?

A restricted free agent is a player whose contract has expired but for whom the team still owns the players NHL rights. The length of time the team maintains rights is based on a number of factors like age and when that players signed their first contract. As is whether that player has arbitration rights or is able to receive an offer sheet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pardon my ignorance but is RFA like an arbitration year ? if the team doesn't come to terms with a RFA do they retain 1 year of rights at an arbitrated figure ?

 

If the player and team can't come to terms it depends on whether or not the player has arbitration rights. if they don't have arbitration rights and the player and terms can't come to an agreement the player cannot play until they do. You maintain the rights to the player until the player is eligible for UFA.

If they do have arbitration rights the either the team or player can select arbitration and then whatever the arbitrator awards the player has to play under unless the teams walks away and lets the player become UFA. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On Backstrom....

 

It's one of those things, where we really have no idea.   Some elite players DO transition very well into coaching, mentoring, or even management.   Others don't.   And...many, are frankly horrible at it.

 

What we know about Backstrom is he has a great work ethic, interviews well, has class, works well with the team and coaches, and has loads of playing success and experience.

 

He may, or may not, transition well as a coach.  And we have no way of knowing. 

 

But, the Flames....might.   and I would suggest that they should have at least evaluated him for future roles with the organization.   I would imagine that they did, and I'd be dissapointed if they didn't.   That's a fair thing to ask for, and probably about all we can ask for.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On Backstrom....

 

It's one of those things, where we really have no idea.   Some elite players DO transition very well into coaching, mentoring, or even management.   Others don't.   And...many, are frankly horrible at it.

 

What we know about Backstrom is he has a great work ethic, interviews well, has class, works well with the team and coaches, and has loads of playing success and experience.

 

He may, or may not, transition well as a coach.  And we have no way of knowing. 

 

But, the Flames....might.   and I would suggest that they should have at least evaluated him for future roles with the organization.   I would imagine that they did, and I'd be dissapointed if they didn't.   That's a fair thing to ask for, and probably about all we can ask for.

I am sure he will land on his feet somewhere, he is at a crossroads of whether to continue playing (Europe likely) or possibly venture into other hockey avenues or not.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ortio is too inexperienced and unproven to be considered a 1A or starter. Ramo is going to be too expensive to be slotted as 1B or backup.

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ramo as the 1A or starter (in approximate order):

Andersen, Bishop, Neuvirth, Allen, Fleury, Varlamov, Elliott, Mason, Schneider, Murray, Raanta, Reimer, Bernier, Halak, Enroth, Darling, Smith, Kuemper, Anderson

Guys (potentially available) I like better then Ortio as the 1B or backup (in approximate order):

Murray, Neuvirth, Raanta, Allen, Kuemper, Enroth

.

Why is Ortio too expensive?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...