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The Official Monahan Thread

Monahan staying the right choice?  

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  1. 1. Monahan staying the right choice?



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There is no way he is getting sent down. 

Even if he doesn't record another point he has TWO on the night. 

4 GP - 3 G - 2 A - 5 P... 

As a 18 year old.... 

He is staying up, and he'll probably continue this amazing pace for a little while. He has earned it so far. 

Not only 5 points, but all on 5 on 5.  Very low TOI and almost no PP time.  Pretty impressive.

 

I had in my head 5 pts after 9 games - if he gets more than that he stays, less he goes down.  Well here we are and I guess if he gets no more points, he probably goes down.  But that seems unlikely at this point.

 

Having said that, I think it all comes down to how he handles the road trip - Ana, SJ, LA and Phx is a tough go.  Wouldn't be at all surprising if he is shut out for all of them.

 

But if he can hold his own on that trip, he deserves to stay.  I was always against him staying, but if you're one of the best players on the team every night...

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Looks like Monahan to me, pretty much what I expected. Solid piece for the future and I just don't know why we'd send him down to lead Ottawa again. He's been on an island there and is why we got him at 6 imho.

He's gotta get stronger and especially at the dot. I think the best learning curve is here to build on that, not go up against teenagers some more.

If the A were an option I'd be okay with that, but it's not.

I think he's good for Baertschi also, as Monahan's got good vision and makes quick decisions, as shown on Baertschi's goal tonight.

He has rookie wrinkles, but hey, most of our lineup makes rookie-like mistakes.

Stempniak looks rejuvenated by the young guys, and Hudler slides in and out. I like how Hartley's working it, they've often been a dominant line when we're rolling.

errrr, uh...the SbaM line...SbaM, eggs, SbaM, SbaM and SbaM....'SbaM SbaM, wonderful SbaM'..... 

I'm thinking the "Triple S" line. Sven, Sean & Stemp.

lolz How would Monahan develop better with the chokie Flyers.Good to see you have a sense of humor/

Only I know if I was joking. -_- [insert evil laugh]

********************************************

Seriously, Monahan is already showing what I hoped for when available @ the Flames pick.

I wanted either him or Nurse (time will tell which would have been the better choice).

 

We've got a good 1 here IMO. I saw/see him as a 1 or 2 center in the very near future. If he's our #2 it means we drafted/traded for a star.

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@FF52

I kinda like The EuroStemps line

Good to see all you guys again!

But only Sven is a Euro so that leaves Monahan out of the nickname.

 

Welcome back.

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I personally think points will have nothing to do if Monahan stays or goes. His defensive play has been subpar and his faceoffs have been terrible. Faceoffs is to be expected, but he was deemed NHL ready due to his defensive game. Time and time again he seems to get caught up watching the play and forgets what he should be doing. He was better last night, but he still really needs to improve that aspect of the game.

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I personally think points will have nothing to do if Monahan stays or goes. His defensive play has been subpar and his faceoffs have been terrible. Faceoffs is to be expected, but he was deemed NHL ready due to his defensive game. Time and time again he seems to get caught up watching the play and forgets what he should be doing. He was better last night, but he still really needs to improve that aspect of the game.

 

I don't think the points should come into play.  But I bet the Ken Kings of the Flames love the excitement and optimism surrounding the club right now.  It will be interesting to see if there isn't a bit of pressure to keep him up right now to satisfy the fan base.  

 

But I agree with you that it is more than offense that should decide his future.  He has looked underwater at times.  Though to his credit he has gotten better every game.  Which to me is really what you look for.  

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What if he currently has 0-goals and 0-assists?

 

Based on his play alone, would we still want him to stay with the Flames after 9-games?

IMO yes. My only question or concern with having him up here was his confidence specifically with his offensive ability. I think, event points aside, he's proven he can play at an NHL level and while yes he has holes I think NHL coaching and the NHL game is the best environment for him to learn. He's already shown how he can improve in 4 games so I don't see where the OHL would help. I think he continues to play in a third line role and just get worked more into the pp

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Not only 5 points, but all on 5 on 5.  Very low TOI and almost no PP time.  Pretty impressive.

 

I had in my head 5 pts after 9 games - if he gets more than that he stays, less he goes down.  Well here we are and I guess if he gets no more points, he probably goes down.  But that seems unlikely at this point.

 

Having said that, I think it all comes down to how he handles the road trip - Ana, SJ, LA and Phx is a tough go.  Wouldn't be at all surprising if he is shut out for all of them.

 

But if he can hold his own on that trip, he deserves to stay.  I was always against him staying, but if you're one of the best players on the team every night...

This .....

 

He has to prove he can play against top defensive and centers, and still be successful. He did that against Vancouver, and Montreal, but the ducks, sharks and Phx will be very difficult for him. I personally think that he will do fine. He'll probably gets something like 1 goal and 1 assist. 

 

He'll stay. one of the reasons why he has been so successful in the first 4 games is his hockey sense. right place right time, right pass at the right time etc.

He isn't physical out playing anyone or out skating anyone, but he just seems to be in the right place at the right time. these kinds of players stick around for years on a top six line. 

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I'm typically an advocate of sending the new kid(s) down for a year for more conditioning.  They know they'll be in the big leagues soon, and that is typically enough to keep them energized and motivated, resulting in a hungrier player.

 

Having said that, Monahan should stay with the Flames.  For all the reasons everyone's listed (he'll learn more from the coaches/players/exposure/atmosphere in the NHL than back in junior).

 

I love watching this kid.  He looks to have the hunger and passion of a young Theo Fleury, and the hockey smarts of a back-in-the-day Yzerman, Sakic, and Modano.

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What if he currently has 0-goals and 0-assists?

 

Based on his play alone, would we still want him to stay with the Flames after 9-games?

 

I think this is a very good question, and I think the answer is actually pretty easily a no based on his play thus far.

 

The kid has flashes of brilliance, but he is clearly underwater when he does not have the puck. 9 games is really hard to judge a player based on points, players have hot and cold streaks, and lots of talented young guys get off to an early starts while vets normally take a while. Does anyone honestly expect Tomas Hertl to be first in the league in goals, and between him and Galchenyuk represent 2 of the top 3 scorers at the end of the season?

 

Having said that, I think Monohan has also shown marked improvement every game. IF he keeps that trend up, I think he either would be playing well enough that he should stay, or at least would be close enough that with the game by game improvement you take the chance.

 

With his current play, what happens in January when the vets throughout the league are firing on all cylinders.

 

Food for thought for the "his stats show he should stay" crowd

if the end of his nine games was today, and everything projected out where it is now his stats line would be 7 goals 5 assists and 11 points and -2. (before anyone points out that 7+5 =12, both goals and assists rounded up). Pretty good stat line. of course that also suggests that he will end the season with 62 goals, 41 assists and 103 points, -21. I hate to say it but we can probably expect his points totals to drop from their current rate, which also likely makes his =/- drop. less points means his minutes drop, etc as well. 

I think his stats are indicative of his NHL talent, not of how ready he is for full time duty today.

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I'm very suprised to hear so many say negative things about his defensive game. While yes it is developing I think it's actually been very good and more often than not I find Monahan is in he right position and certainly not lost by any means. At times for sure but that's the nature of being a young player. Personally Monahan has been more impressive than Baertschi

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I think that in a perfect world you send him down, no question. But this isn't a perfect world and there are several factors that suggest he should stay:

 

  1. The Flames can't look at their roster and say, "You're great kid, but you're not one of the top guys on the team." This roster just isn't good enough to say he hasn't earned his spot.
  2. If we were sending him down to a winning team like we did with Baertschi, that would be a different story. Here, he will be going down to one of the worst teams in the OHL and I just don't see how his development benefits from it.
  3. Monahan will get sufficient ice time playing for the Flames. Sure, he hasn't got as much as we want in the first few games, but the coaches are likely trying to ease him in and get him up to NHL game speed. If he keeps his progress up I suspect he'll get second line minutes and some pp time. The difference in ice time he'll get in the OHL compared to the NHL isn't sufficient to justify sending him down.
  4. From a business perspective, the fans of this team need something to cheer about. The future with Monahan and Baertschi is that something right now. It wouldn't make financial sense to throw him down.

Given all the above factors, I just don't see them sending him down.

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I think that in a perfect world you send him down, no question. But this isn't a perfect world and there are several factors that suggest he should stay:

 

  1. The Flames can't look at their roster and say, "You're great kid, but you're not one of the top guys on the team." This roster just isn't good enough to say he hasn't earned his spot.
  2. If we were sending him down to a winning team like we did with Baertschi, that would be a different story. Here, he will be going down to one of the worst teams in the OHL and I just don't see how his development benefits from it.
  3. Monahan will get sufficient ice time playing for the Flames. Sure, he hasn't got as much as we want in the first few games, but the coaches are likely trying to ease him in and get him up to NHL game speed. If he keeps his progress up I suspect he'll get second line minutes and some pp time. The difference in ice time he'll get in the OHL compared to the NHL isn't sufficient to justify sending him down.
  4. From a business perspective, the fans of this team need something to cheer about. The future with Monahan and Baertschi is that something right now. It wouldn't make financial sense to throw him down.

Given all the above factors, I just don't see them sending him down.

1. I don't think you say you got beat out of the spot but rather you say we are sending you down so you get meaningful minutes. Next year we think you will stick with the team, however for this year we would like you to work on X,Y,Z to make that happen.

2. The underlying assumption should be that Ottawa would trade him to a contender, If the flames do not believe he will be traded, that does change things, however i think it is pretty likely he gets traded whether Calgary influences the process or not. the 67's are not going anywhere this year, what exactly do they stand to gain from keeping him vs trading him for future assets. ALL teams in the CHL go through fairly frequent contender-pretender-rebuild cycles.

3. I don't anticipate his minutes going much above his current #'s until at least the trade deadline. I don't think he has jumped ahead of Backlund and Stajan will most likely be ahead of him as well. If the coaches agree with you then they should keep him.

4. Although I agree that is likely to be a factor, it should not be.

 

At the end of the day, I must admit I am biased towards sending kids back down in their draft year with very few exceptions. And honestly, my main reason has nothing to do with their play. 18 year old bodies are still growing let alone filling out and they are playing against men far bigger then them. With talent which is good enough that they could/should stay in the NHL in their draft year, I just don't think it is worth the risk of an injury that could impact their career.

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I personally think points will have nothing to do if Monahan stays or goes. His defensive play has been subpar and his faceoffs have been terrible. Faceoffs is to be expected, but he was deemed NHL ready due to his defensive game. Time and time again he seems to get caught up watching the play and forgets what he should be doing. He was better last night, but he still really needs to improve that aspect of the game.

I totally disagree,..hes 4th on the team in FO%, 4th among rookies in thw league and 16th in the western conference. Hes going to make mistakes, of course but barring a meltdown in the next 5 games, sending him back is ludicrous. You dont send him back simply to not burn the contract.that sends a message that your tanking and goes against the teaching of play to win.He has nothing to achieve in junior, and even burke has made it clear so long as the coach can guarantee he gets regular minutes, he stays.hes being productive, hes improving and hes getting good minutes, all pretty much 5 on 5.

I think he should be sent to the WJC, but aside from that hes proving he belongs here.

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For anyone who's played hockey on this board: what helped improve your game more, playing against better competition or playing in a league that you can dominate? In my experience it's playing against better players, otherwise it's too easy to play down to your competition. He hasn't looked terrible and the best way for him to work on his game is by playing against guys who are better than him. Everyone on here loves glencross for some reason, and Monahan has looked better than him in every game. (Glencross is off topic, but I can't stand the way he plays).

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I think most agree that Monahan has no challenge that will take his skill set to the next level in Junior. His chemistry with Baertschi is great and he had success in the NHL so far.

 

I would love the kid to stay with the team, because it is fun to watch him. It is easy to get up or stay up long with the excitement of seeing the kid play.

 

But I think he can learn some things in Juniors. His leadership skills, things you develop while you are allowed to be a junior. So for his development I believe it would be better, if he goes back to junior (even without a trade). He will have a trainings plan from the Flames coaching stuff and he will be back next year with more muscles and he will be ready for the NHL, not only as a player but as a person as well.

 

Greetings,

 

Carsten.

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I think most agree that Monahan has no challenge that will take his skill set to the next level in Junior. His chemistry with Baertschi is great and he had success in the NHL so far.

 

I would love the kid to stay with the team, because it is fun to watch him. It is easy to get up or stay up long with the excitement of seeing the kid play.

 

But I think he can learn some things in Juniors. His leadership skills, things you develop while you are allowed to be a junior. So for his development I believe it would be better, if he goes back to junior (even without a trade). He will have a trainings plan from the Flames coaching stuff and he will be back next year with more muscles and he will be ready for the NHL, not only as a player but as a person as well.

 

Greetings,

 

Carsten.

 

Just curious why you think he would not get the same training plan if he stays up here?

or

Won't he still come next year with those same more muscles?

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I don't base his staying on points as more of positions while playing.  The puck seems to find its way to good players and good players adapt to the play, case in point Monahan. Adaptation is the best means of survival in this league he seems to be adapting just fine.  Frankly, as the vets gain their momentum he will have become smarter, faster and more confident in his abilities. It is not like at this point his abilities have plateaued. He will run into a dry spell on the score sheet but that is natural for anyone in this league.

 

 Development is unique to the individual. He is a different player than Backlund and Sven both in build and hockey IQ so comparing their situations to his is irrelevant . The decision to demote him ( which it is) isn't going to be a easy pill to swallow regardless how they sugar coat it, if that is the decision of management. IMHO, I was for sending him down, now I really don't believe that he can further enhance his abilities in the CHL past what we have seen.

I think this is a very good question, and I think the answer is actually pretty easily a no based on his play thus far.

 

The kid has flashes of brilliance, but he is clearly underwater when he does not have the puck. 9 games is really hard to judge a player based on points, players have hot and cold streaks, and lots of talented young guys get off to an early starts while vets normally take a while. Does anyone honestly expect Tomas Hertl to be first in the league in goals, and between him and Galchenyuk represent 2 of the top 3 scorers at the end of the season?

 

Having said that, I think Monohan has also shown marked improvement every game. IF he keeps that trend up, I think he either would be playing well enough that he should stay, or at least would be close enough that with the game by game improvement you take the chance.

 

With his current play, what happens in January when the vets throughout the league are firing on all cylinders.

 

Food for thought for the "his stats show he should stay" crowd

if the end of his nine games was today, and everything projected out where it is now his stats line would be 7 goals 5 assists and 11 points and -2. (before anyone points out that 7+5 =12, both goals and assists rounded up). Pretty good stat line. of course that also suggests that he will end the season with 62 goals, 41 assists and 103 points, -21. I hate to say it but we can probably expect his points totals to drop from their current rate, which also likely makes his =/- drop. less points means his minutes drop, etc as well. 



I think his stats are indicative of his NHL talent, not of how ready he is for full time duty today.

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I'm very suprised to hear so many say negative things about his defensive game. While yes it is developing I think it's actually been very good and more often than not I find Monahan is in he right position and certainly not lost by any means. At times for sure but that's the nature of being a young player. Personally Monahan has been more impressive than Baertschi

Totally agree.

 

His positioning has been excellent, he supports the puck, gives the defenseman an out.. IMO, his defensive and neutral zone play has been more impressive than his offense

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I think you have more time to develop in junior then in the NHL. During a 82 Games schedule most players lose quite some weight.

 

Even if a young body should be able to endure the load, it may result in injuries in the later phase of the season. With fighting against the weight loss.

 

From most other sports I have learned, the earlier you start as professional, the earlier the body wears out and Hockey is for sure more demanding then those other kinds of sports. What is a year, if it helps preventing injuries in the beginning.

 

I am just afraid that the kid is not sent back because the fans are so desperately wanting to see him play and that shouldn't be the reason. And honestly, I am for sure one of these fans, because he would be one strong reason to get up at 3 in the morning.

 

Greetings,

 

Carsten.

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Part of me thinks he should go back to junior.

 

I hope nobody listens to that part of me.   What the heck....another goal?  And now he's the clutch game winner?

 

I'm speechless.

 

Can't send him down.

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He's projected to be a 2nd-liner, with an outside chance of being a first-liner.  

 

Wow, the wrongest thing I've ever posted on these boards.

 

time for my beatings.  I'll take them willingly.

 

At Least....I agreed with selecting him...possibly some small salvation for me there.

 

Unbelieveable player.  Steal of the draft, at this early stage.  

 

Next question:  If Colorado offered us Mackinnon for Monahan now, what would we do?

 

I think I would just get confused and start drinking.

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