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Realistic Trade suggestions for improvement

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11 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Cost and impact to the current team is my only concern.  I have no issues dealing a 1st.  I have no issue swapping a lesser C for a top C.  I have no issue trading some futures.  I have no issue using Tkachuk in the deal, as we have had to shunt him to RW to play top 3.  I would miss the player and he is the right type of player for playoffs, even if he hasn't yet been a factor for us.

 

Sutter pointed out that we lack star power, so we have to be perfect to win.  That's not real.  We have a chance to grab a top player in the NHL.  Let's not get hung up on the loss of one player or a 1st rounder.  

 

Announcing Bill Murray GIF   87Sl6.gif

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3 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

Then stop proposing those trades.

 

Most of the trades proposed in here and most advocated by you, knowingly make us worse in the future.   The Flames made similar trades.  Now the future is here.    Every time a trade is proposed that sacrifices our future, this is a proposal to become a tank team.   It makes us worse, and gives us some immediate lipstick.

 

Responsible asset management that considers our future is not something to be ashamed of, nor does it make us a "tank team".    The short term benefit trades "let's put in all the chips" are the exact trades that got us here.   And you know that.   You say you don't like losing but I'm never certain if you mean that past this moment.   I don't want to be losing in 2025.   You're pretty much planning for it.

 

Here's the problem.  People "didn't want to lose" for the past 5 years already, and there's nothing left in the tank.   It's your 2025 right now, because of decisions we already made.

 

I'm not sure why you just listed off 6 of the worst goaltending decisions we ever made, consecutively, literally all of which consisted of renting washed up has beens with the exception of Rittich, who never was, and was too old to develop into one.    That is exactly my point.   If we cared from the net out like people here do about C, we might be in a very different place right now.  Nobody here is advocating picking up a 30+ year old C who had good numbers when they were 28.

 

What are you proposing?  Trade for picks?  How does that make us better (improvement) in 5 years.  You aren't getting 5 x 1st rounders in 2 years draft.  

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53 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

What are you proposing?  Trade for picks?  How does that make us better (improvement) in 5 years.  You aren't getting 5 x 1st rounders in 2 years draft.  

 

I simply propose not wanting to lose in the future and trading like that (if trades are needed).   Even in your question above, you're trying to put a timeframe on it implying the value of "how soon" we will be better.   First of all, considering our future will absolutely make us better in 5 years.   But more importantly we need to stop thinking like that.  We need to stop making excuses about how it's okay to sacrifice our future because of whatever artificial timeframe we've set to justify making short term decisions.  There is no justification unless we are clearly one player away from the cup.

 

I was proposing that (trade for picks) in the last couple drafts when core defencemen and goaltenders were available on the cheap in what was considered weak drafts.  Had we done that we'd be almost halfway through our rebuild right now.   Which means yes we would be a LOT better in 5 years.   That alone has cost us one-two years of a longer rebuild.

 

So at this point, first off, I need to clarify that other teams Do do this and do find ways to have multiple first rounders. 

Look at Detroit. 

They had 8 picks this year including two first rounders. 

Last year?  12 picks.

Year before?  11 picks

Before that, 10 picks with two first rounders

 

Do I need to do a comparison?    BTW they actually scout all over the world and invest in their pipeline, and a LOT of these prospects are looking Really good, right now.  Sure we can make fun of the team today.  That won't last.

 

Let's stop pretending that responsible asset management is impossible.  Other teams are embarrassing us.  Blockbuster trades?  Not really.   It's mostly small trades that they've upgraded over time, that's how they got Cossa.   It's because they consider their future in every move that they make.  It adds up.

 

What do I propose we do now, other than fire BT?

 

Yeah.  Trade for picks.   But if you want to be more gentle about it, I'd be okay with trading for NHLers of the right age and position.  Actual planning.   Eichel isn't even the player we want from Buffalo, I'd want Dahlin from them.  And let's not do the whole that's impossible thing, because so is Eichel and we can't stop talking about that.   Noah Dobson then.  Pick that phone up.  The alternative is trading for picks like Responsible teams who care about their future do All the time.   You want to delay the rebuild...impossible.  You want to shorten it?  Maybe.  Pick up some young goaltenders and defencemen who are elite.   Pay the price.   they'll help you even in the short term more than Eichel ever could.   If we could shore up our back end with players under 23 heading into these next two drafts, that's really our best chance at minimal pain imho.

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2 hours ago, kehatch said:

 

Unless it involves a trade of Gaudreau or Tkachuk, no to chasing another RW.  With Gaudreau, Mangipane, and Tkachuk all due raises next season we have too much of our cap allocated to the wing already.  That is also the position of most of our best prospects.  We have already burned enough of our cap and assets trying to solve that position based on the false presumption that is the missing ingredient to our top line.  

 

Otherwise, it really depends on what the Flames want to accomplish.  If we are interested in making the playoffs, maybe winning a round, while we quietly rebuild in the background (aka spend no picks/prospects) then filling a few holes makes sense.  The problem with this approach is its a recipe for perpetual mediocrity.  Your never bad enough to get the high picks (or the traction to get ownership to buy in on a full rebuild), and your never good enough to win a cup.  

 

The Flames are in their prime.  We are never going to be in a better position with the current core.  Meanwhile, we just got 7-million in cap space due to the draft lottery and one of the elite Cs has become available (something that almost never happens).  This C is 24 years old supporting us now and in the future, and he would instantly become the best player on the Flames roster at the most important position. 

 

Its time to push those chips in and try to graduate from a playoff threat to a cup threat.


 

from what yOu are saying is that we have too much spent on wing, but what I get out of all of who you are saying we are paying is, we have too much spent on LW. I get the need to spend money elsewhere, but the fact we have it overloaded on LW is a huge problem. The whole system is overloaded on the LW, like you said…

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2 hours ago, kehatch said:

 

Unless it involves a trade of Gaudreau or Tkachuk, no to chasing another RW.  With Gaudreau, Mangipane, and Tkachuk all due raises next season we have too much of our cap allocated to the wing already.  That is also the position of most of our best prospects.  We have already burned enough of our cap and assets trying to solve that position based on the false presumption that is the missing ingredient to our top line.  

 

Otherwise, it really depends on what the Flames want to accomplish.  If we are interested in making the playoffs, maybe winning a round, while we quietly rebuild in the background (aka spend no picks/prospects) then filling a few holes makes sense.  The problem with this approach is its a recipe for perpetual mediocrity.  Your never bad enough to get the high picks (or the traction to get ownership to buy in on a full rebuild), and your never good enough to win a cup.  

 

The Flames are in their prime.  We are never going to be in a better position with the current core.  Meanwhile, we just got 7-million in cap space due to the draft lottery and one of the elite Cs has become available (something that almost never happens).  This C is 24 years old supporting us now and in the future, and he would instantly become the best player on the Flames roster at the most important position. 

 

Its time to push those chips in and try to graduate from a playoff threat to a cup threat.

Yeah, no he’s not instantly the best player, he’s actually well behind Monahan and Gaudreau…maybe equal output to Tkacuck and Lindholm…maybe cause he’s a Ctr he should be piling up Pts assisting both wings but he’s not done that…add to the injury issue which is a huge ???? He’s not even close…

 

then add in your loosing at least one of those same equal or better output players, and then some and cap

room is eaten up…nope!

 

What Cgy needs to do is trade one the LW’s in which is a very deep area of strength and acquire a top RW…and maybe to a lesser degree, a 3rd line Ctr and RW too…hears in is the issue and it would Cost something…

 

Tkachuc and Gaudreau while amazing to have are both LW and top line LW’s so you could Probably trade one straight across for a top line RW but then not waters down the LW some…or we could trade a pick and prospect along with either Manjin or Dube but then we still need a 3rd line Ctr and RW to play with whoever stays…very tough call…the other options would be moving Lindhom to Ctr ans using Backlund to land a top line RW but then you still need a 3rd line Crt and RW…

 

personally, I think the best return is Gaudreau, which could

land you the top line RW and maybe a 3rd line Ctr or RW and then your ahead of the game…unless of course someone overpays for Tachuck…meaning a 1st, a top line RW or Ctr and a solid prospect, otherwise what’s the point?

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51 minutes ago, MP5029 said:

Yeah, no he’s not instantly the best player, he’s actually well behind Monahan and Gaudreau…maybe equal output to Tkacuck and Lindholm…maybe cause he’s a Ctr he should be piling up Pts assisting both wings but he’s not done that…add to the injury issue which is a huge ???? He’s not even close…

 

then add in your loosing at least one of those same equal or better output players, and then some and cap

room is eaten up…nope!

 

What Cgy needs to do is trade one the LW’s in which is a very deep area of strength and acquire a top RW…and maybe to a lesser degree, a 3rd line Ctr and RW too…hears in is the issue and it would Cost something…

 

Tkachuc and Gaudreau while amazing to have are both LW and top line LW’s so you could Probably trade one straight across for a top line RW but then not waters down the LW some…or we could trade a pick and prospect along with either Manjin or Dube but then we still need a 3rd line Ctr and RW to play with whoever stays…very tough call…the other options would be moving Lindhom to Ctr ans using Backlund to land a top line RW but then you still need a 3rd line Crt and RW…

 

personally, I think the best return is Gaudreau, which could

land you the top line RW and maybe a 3rd line Ctr or RW and then your ahead of the game…unless of course someone overpays for Tachuck…meaning a 1st, a top line RW or Ctr and a solid prospect, otherwise what’s the point?


i get what you’re saying. But I think He’ll better than everyone on our team, but to your point, how much better? The arguments I heard was, he had no one in Buffalo to play with but still gets 80+ points. So there’s that. 
 

if he can get 100+ points with us, I’d it worth it? 
 

I don’t know if trading away 4 NHL players is worth it. I am with JJ that it’s a huge risk to the future. Worry about that then I guess? I dunno. 
 

Can Eichel supplement the draft picks we will give up? 
 

is he worth the opportunity to draft someone in the top 10-14 first round? 
 

we passed on top 4 D last year to trade down. But we will also probably trade him away anyway. 
 

but still. I just get tired of drafting left side players because they’re our BPA. Have more strategy please! 

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1 hour ago, MP5029 said:

Yeah, no he’s not instantly the best player, he’s actually well behind Monahan and Gaudreau…maybe equal output to Tkacuck and Lindholm…maybe cause he’s a Ctr he should be piling up Pts assisting both wings but he’s not done that…add to the injury issue which is a huge ???? He’s not even close…

 

then add in your loosing at least one of those same equal or better output players, and then some and cap

room is eaten up…nope!

 

What Cgy needs to do is trade one the LW’s in which is a very deep area of strength and acquire a top RW…and maybe to a lesser degree, a 3rd line Ctr and RW too…hears in is the issue and it would Cost something…

 

Tkachuc and Gaudreau while amazing to have are both LW and top line LW’s so you could Probably trade one straight across for a top line RW but then not waters down the LW some…or we could trade a pick and prospect along with either Manjin or Dube but then we still need a 3rd line Ctr and RW to play with whoever stays…very tough call…the other options would be moving Lindhom to Ctr ans using Backlund to land a top line RW but then you still need a 3rd line Crt and RW…

 

personally, I think the best return is Gaudreau, which could

land you the top line RW and maybe a 3rd line Ctr or RW and then your ahead of the game…unless of course someone overpays for Tachuck…meaning a 1st, a top line RW or Ctr and a solid prospect, otherwise what’s the point?

 

So, Gaudreau is basically a point per game player, right?  Tkachuk similar.  Monahan similar, but heavier on scoring.

Eichel very similar in output on a bad team. 

Eichel 375 games - 139g 213a 355p

Gaudreau 520 games - 170g 324a 494p

Tkachuk 349 games - 110g 168a 278p

Monahan 591 games - 204g 235a 439p

 

So, you want to trade a LW who leads the team almost every year for a RW and a 3C?

The guy that sets up most of the goals for the C's and RW's.

Eichel with a Marner or Gaudreau is a lot higher scoring.

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2 hours ago, MP5029 said:

Yeah, no he’s not instantly the best player, he’s actually well behind Monahan and Gaudreau…maybe equal output to Tkacuck and Lindholm…maybe cause he’s a Ctr he should be piling up Pts assisting both wings but he’s not done that…add to the injury issue which is a huge ???? He’s not even close…

 

I am going to have to agree to disagree on this one.  I am just going to leave it at that.  

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1 hour ago, sak22 said:

Never Mind I Give Up GIF

 

I feel that way a lot.  Whether it's about the logic of trading for a #1C or a rebuild or the belief that we are a bottom 5 basement team, I'm running out of steam.

This thread used to be a discussion of interesting trades and has devolved into rebuild vs improve vs too late.

I'll stick to just talking about trades now, at least in this thread.

 

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18 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I feel that way a lot.  Whether it's about the logic of trading for a #1C or a rebuild or the belief that we are a bottom 5 basement team, I'm running out of steam.

This thread used to be a discussion of interesting trades and has devolved into rebuild vs improve vs too late.

I'll stick to just talking about trades now, at least in this thread.

 


I don’t believe we are a bottom 5 team at all. I’m in the boat with the People on this. It’s either rebuild now and trade away for picks. 
 

or

 

we know now that we are going go for it now mode, or we wouldn’t be signing Coleman. So, I am torn on Eichel. 
 

on one hand we need the player. On the other it kills the futures and prospect pool to acquire. 
 

Thing is, if Buffalo wants all futures, they can trade for Tkachuk or Monahan in the deal then turnaround and trade them too. They may even have the ability to take on a part of their cap hits. So involving guys like them in the deal isn’t as terrible idea or such a hinderance as it sounds. They might even get more in that deal. and I am not saying trade both for Eichel. 
 

I think it’ll be Tkachuk or Monahan, plus a definitive prospect or two plus one or two firsts depending on whether a prospect or two  are involved or not. 

in a sense, it’s a good deal for the now. I just worry what the team looks like in 5 to 7 years. There just won’t be a succession plan for this core. Like JJ said, there’ll be a forced rebuild, but my guess is in 5 or 6 years. Maybe less if we don’t have succession plans for some players because We have used them in the Eichel deal. 
 

maybe there are deals to recoup those first rounders. 


but Coleman solidified our fate that we are competing now, so I guess we gotta go get Eichel. 

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7 minutes ago, robrob74 said:


I don’t believe we are a bottom 5 team at all. I’m in the boat with the People on this. It’s either rebuild now and trade away for picks. 
 

or

 

we know now that we are going go for it now mode, or we wouldn’t be signing Coleman. So, I am torn on Eichel. 
 

on one hand we need the player. On the other it kills the futures and prospect pool to acquire. 
 

Thing is, if Buffalo wants all futures, they can trade for Tkachuk or Monahan in the deal then turnaround and trade them too. They may even have the ability to take on a part of their cap hits. So involving guys like them in the deal isn’t as terrible idea or such a hinderance as it sounds. They might even get more in that deal. and I am not saying trade both for Eichel. 
 

I think it’ll be Tkachuk or Monahan, plus a definitive prospect or two plus one or two firsts depending on whether a prospect or two  are involved or not. 

in a sense, it’s a good deal for the now. I just worry what the team looks like in 5 to 7 years. There just won’t be a succession plan for this core. Like JJ said, there’ll be a forced rebuild, but my guess is in 5 or 6 years. Maybe less if we don’t have succession plans for some players because We have used them in the Eichel deal. 
 

maybe there are deals to recoup those first rounders. 


but Coleman solidified our fate that we are competing now, so I guess we gotta go get Eichel. 

 

Signing Markstrom and Tanev should have been the clue that we are seeking to improve the team.

Couldn't do it last year all the way due to cap.

This year, Gio's claiming gave us breathing room in cap.

Still have a hangover or two left (Lucic's contract, Backlund aging out).

Coleman, to me, was a desire to have a team that gives a F.

He's not as "high level" as Hyman, but exactly the type of player we needed.

 

I've got no real probalem with Monahan, but it would be nice to have a next-level Monahan.

Tkachuk only gets to me when I think he is being lazy.

Unlike a lot of people, I don't get PO's at Gaudreau very often.

Elite playmakers can't do it all by themselves.

Give them an elite scorer.

 

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Monahan has been really REALLY bad the past two years.  I would even argue his whole line was propped up by Giordano's Norris-level performance.  The whole line is still there and intact but as Giordano aged, the top line lost an elite Dman to play with and has suffered as a result.  Even if Monahan comes back fully healthy from surgeries, he's probably a top 25 Center at best.  More likely a second line Center.

 

Eichel is different.  The guy is a one man machine who creates his own chances.  Yes, Eichel is not a top 5 Center but he's in the same conversation as a Barkov, Point, Pettersson, and Barzal.  So something like a top 9/10/11 Center in the NHL and most importantly, he's 24 so there's room to grow and become even better.  Take the risk with the surgery because we aren't winning a Cup unless we get a Center of his calibre anyways.

 

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4 hours ago, Heartbreaker said:


Should we tell him?

Love.

Tell me what? Your Gonna try and say Eichel is worth and better than? 
 

mark

my words on this, if Eichel dose come here we are in for a very bad time for along time…he’s not worth moving out 2/3 of the main core which is still very good and young…

 

put this Eichel thing another way, who is gonna play with him? If you gotta trade Tkacuck and say Monahan (one as part of the Eichel deal and one for an additional 1st round pick) and then add a prospect…how are you icing anything different than Buf did or in another way more than the one line show we already have had?

 

this Eichle thing makes absolutely no sense…

 

 

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3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Signing Markstrom and Tanev should have been the clue that we are seeking to improve the team.

Couldn't do it last year all the way due to cap.

This year, Gio's claiming gave us breathing room in cap.

Still have a hangover or two left (Lucic's contract, Backlund aging out).

Coleman, to me, was a desire to have a team that gives a F.

He's not as "high level" as Hyman, but exactly the type of player we needed.

 

I've got no real probalem with Monahan, but it would be nice to have a next-level Monahan.

Tkachuk only gets to me when I think he is being lazy.

Unlike a lot of people, I don't get PO's at Gaudreau very often.

Elite playmakers can't do it all by themselves.

Give them an elite scorer.

 


 

I definitely agree with all of this. 
 

and you’re right, there’s only so much Gaudreau can do on his own. I think it stifles his creativity by not having anyone to play with. It was good at first until teams caught on to the 1-2 punch they started off as. 
 

I think that how you describe Tkachuk, it’s how I’ve seen him for a few years now. He needs more consistency. I love when he’s on, but like a lot on the team it’s tough to watch when they’re not playing: 

 

 

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1 hour ago, robrob74 said:


 

I definitely agree with all of this. 
 

and you’re right, there’s only so much Gaudreau can do on his own. I think it stifles his creativity by not having anyone to play with. It was good at first until teams caught on to the 1-2 punch they started off as. 
 

I think that how you describe Tkachuk, it’s how I’ve seen him for a few years now. He needs more consistency. I love when he’s on, but like a lot on the team it’s tough to watch when they’re not playing: 

 

 

 

In prior years, you would see 2 others take of with Johnny on a rush.

The last two yeas almost non existent.

That's how a lot of top lines score goals.

3 o 2 or 2 on 1.

It's a tap in.

Tap, tap tappy in.

 

As much as I like Tkachuk with him, it's too slow.

Becomes a skill line.

 

I would trade Monahan in a heartbeat for Eichel and alternatively, Tkachuk in a few heartbeats.

You can't blame the lack of rush on the coaches.

 

 

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I have been thinking about this for a while and have went back and forth on the whole Eichel thing. Yesterday I was reading that Dvorak in Arizona is available, and That they would want mostly picks and/or prospects.

I also think that Monahan could have good trade value to the teams that were/are in on Eichel, because he’s not waiving to go to Buffalo or Arizona for that matter in a swap for Dvorak. 
I also believe even if it’s not everyone’s cup of tea that the team is going to go for it, and there’s no point in trading one of our core player for picks and prospects, so it’s time to make some good hockey trades, and this is what I was thinking.

1. Monahan to Boston for Debrusk and their 1st in 2022. Is this a good trade for us? I also really like Trent Frederic, but don’t know if Frederic and a 1st works because of salary for Boston.

2. Monahan to NYR for Kravtsov. I don’t know if it can be a straight up deal for the Rangers, or if we need to take some salary back? But that is the kind of young RW (who is Left Handed, I know) that we need.

3. Monahan to Vegas for Tuch and their 1st in 2022. Tuch definitely adds size to our lineup, and fits more in the Sutter mold, but don’t know if this is a good trade for the team.

 

With those trades in mind, now instead of going for the big “Jack” fish. What if we went to Arizona and asked for Dvorak and Chychrun? They are both very similar in their current roles, salaries, and age as to when we made a move for Hannifin and Lindholm. But what would it take? Arizona has said they are in full rebuild mode and are willing to take picks and prospects. Last time the trade with Carolina cost a Top Pairing D-Man, a potential top 6 winger with edge, and a Blue Chip D man.

My suggestion is Valimaki (blue chipper on his way), Pelltier (a good top 6 winger who plays with heart), our 1st round pick in 2022 and our 2nd in 2023 to offset the big name player.

 

It has the potential to make us even deeper, harder to play against, and the cap hits are basically the same as Eichel.

This is what I see:

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Kravtsov/Tuch

Tkachuk - Dvorak - Coleman

Mangiapane - Backlund - Dube

Lucic - Ruzicka - Pitlick

 

Chychrun - Anderson

Hannifin - Tanev

Zadorov - Stone?

 

Marky - Vlad

 

Im curious what others think, as well to see a conversation other than Eichel

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Tuch is out for 6 months.

Even if he was healthy, we wouldn't get him + 1st for Monahan.

I like Dvorak, but we are running out of picks in 2022.

Have an extra 2nd, but no 3rds, 4th or 6th.

I don't know what we could use to get him; if we are out on Eichel, then perhaps we could use Zary to get him.

Uggg.

 

No thanks to Debrusk.

If we are trading Monahan, it means we have a C already traded for.

A top 4 D + a RW?

Sure.

 

(Oops, didn't see the later Dvorak trade suggestion).

No doubt, Chychrun would be a win for us, but I doubt ARI even considers this move.

He is as untouchable as any we have, perhaps even more so.

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44 minutes ago, pikey7883 said:

I have been thinking about this for a while and have went back and forth on the whole Eichel thing. Yesterday I was reading that Dvorak in Arizona is available, and That they would want mostly picks and/or prospects.

I also think that Monahan could have good trade value to the teams that were/are in on Eichel, because he’s not waiving to go to Buffalo or Arizona for that matter in a swap for Dvorak. 
I also believe even if it’s not everyone’s cup of tea that the team is going to go for it, and there’s no point in trading one of our core player for picks and prospects, so it’s time to make some good hockey trades, and this is what I was thinking.

1. Monahan to Boston for Debrusk and their 1st in 2022. Is this a good trade for us? I also really like Trent Frederic, but don’t know if Frederic and a 1st works because of salary for Boston.

2. Monahan to NYR for Kravtsov. I don’t know if it can be a straight up deal for the Rangers, or if we need to take some salary back? But that is the kind of young RW (who is Left Handed, I know) that we need.

3. Monahan to Vegas for Tuch and their 1st in 2022. Tuch definitely adds size to our lineup, and fits more in the Sutter mold, but don’t know if this is a good trade for the team.

 

With those trades in mind, now instead of going for the big “Jack” fish. What if we went to Arizona and asked for Dvorak and Chychrun? They are both very similar in their current roles, salaries, and age as to when we made a move for Hannifin and Lindholm. But what would it take? Arizona has said they are in full rebuild mode and are willing to take picks and prospects. Last time the trade with Carolina cost a Top Pairing D-Man, a potential top 6 winger with edge, and a Blue Chip D man.

My suggestion is Valimaki (blue chipper on his way), Pelltier (a good top 6 winger who plays with heart), our 1st round pick in 2022 and our 2nd in 2023 to offset the big name player.

 

It has the potential to make us even deeper, harder to play against, and the cap hits are basically the same as Eichel.

This is what I see:

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Kravtsov/Tuch

Tkachuk - Dvorak - Coleman

Mangiapane - Backlund - Dube

Lucic - Ruzicka - Pitlick

 

Chychrun - Anderson

Hannifin - Tanev

Zadorov - Stone?

 

Marky - Vlad

 

Im curious what others think, as well to see a conversation other than Eichel


Thanks for that post Pikey. I’ve been preaching an Eichel trade for I think over a year now, and it’s absolutely welcome to see alternative suggestions. I myself have been thinking of how to get Dvorak out of Arizona as a backup plan as well and I like your idea of both Chychrun and Dvorak. Personally, I’ve been a fan of Tuch for a long time, and I think you may be on to something there. VGK, being so thin up the middle of the ice and having all star wingers, could be a team that can give Monahan his best year for points yet. He definitely has support in VGK to realize some big numbers. And I wouldn’t care that Tuch will be out to start the season especially if we can grab Dvorak as well. 
 

Great post. As usual. I’m on board. 👍🏻

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BT and owner ship will not give up what it takes top bring in big names as long as the Calgary fans will keep paying to watch they will keep putting a sub par team use what they have till they drop giving up 6 million for Gio instead of dropping Kyl was the dumbest thing they could have ever done all I here now is how hard it will be to fill his shoes. Now there wasting the 6 mill on a bunch of lesser talented players so sad.

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Yeah I can see why people would think about Chychrun based on Arizona seemingly gunning for the bottom this year, but they are still in that conversation with Chychrun and I can't see a cash strapped team trading away a player who is trending towards being a top dman who is signed for 4 more years at a pretty sweet cap hit.  I just don't see it happening.

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43 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

Tuch is out for 6 months.

Even if he was healthy, we wouldn't get him + 1st for Monahan.

I like Dvorak, but we are running out of picks in 2022.

Have an extra 2nd, but no 3rds, 4th or 6th.

I don't know what we could use to get him; if we are out on Eichel, then perhaps we could use Zary to get him.

Uggg.

 

No thanks to Debrusk.

If we are trading Monahan, it means we have a C already traded for.

A top 4 D + a RW?

Sure.

 

(Oops, didn't see the later Dvorak trade suggestion).

No doubt, Chychrun would be a win for us, but I doubt ARI even considers this move.

He is as untouchable as any we have, perhaps even more so.

I agree that he should be untouchable, but Arizona has done some moves this off-season that are all but unquestionable. They got the Canucks out of cap jail, and lent a helping hand to both Florida and Philly. Then they traded a young goalie away, all while they’re signings have been less than stellar. 
I think Valimaki, Pelltier, a 1st in 2022 (or maybe move it to 2023 as they have lots of bullets this coming year). Definitely gets the conversation started for them.

On a side note, if it takes a Center, I would consider Zary if it meant we were getting both Chychrun and Dvorak back. 

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22 hours ago, robrob74 said:


i get what you’re saying. But I think He’ll better than everyone on our team, but to your point, how much better? The arguments I heard was, he had no one in Buffalo to play with but still gets 80+ points. So there’s that. 
 

if he can get 100+ points with us, I’d it worth it? 
 

I don’t know if trading away 4 NHL players is worth it. I am with JJ that it’s a huge risk to the future. Worry about that then I guess? I dunno. 
 

Can Eichel supplement the draft picks we will give up? 
 

is he worth the opportunity to draft someone in the top 10-14 first round? 
 

we passed on top 4 D last year to trade down. But we will also probably trade him away anyway. 
 

but still. I just get tired of drafting left side players because they’re our BPA. Have more strategy please! 

but still. I just get tired of drafting left side players because they’re our BPA. Have more strategy please! 


exactly why we find Cgy where it is today..

 

this Eichel thing is not worth considering…

 

why on earth would

we keep Gaudreau over Tachuck? Gaudreau is one dimensional, offensive only and afterwards is a bit of a liability I don’t see how a 

 

Gaudreau/Eichel/Lindholm line is any better than 

 

Tachuck/Monahan/Lindholm line 

 

the latter is 2 mil cheaper…

 

 

 

 

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20 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

I feel that way a lot.  Whether it's about the logic of trading for a #1C or a rebuild or the belief that we are a bottom 5 basement team, I'm running out of steam.

This thread used to be a discussion of interesting trades and has devolved into rebuild vs improve vs too late.

I'll stick to just talking about trades now, at least in this thread.

 

 

I'm going to lay off this thread and a few others for a bit, this is not the effect I'm trying to make, the boards should be enjoyable for everyone.

 

My parting comment though, is that change is inevitable.   I disagree that this thread has devolved, it may actually be evolving, something we all have to continually do.

 

Page after page after page of people proposing we acquire a forward (usually a center) for either draft picks or prospects, from my perspective is neither interesting nor productive nor realistic.   It doesn't strike me as evolved.

 

If someone suggests a young goalie acquisition or a young defenceman acquisition or God forbid an acquisition of draft picks / prospects on here it has in the past been either dismissed or hotly contested.     Even though, in hindsight these have almost always been the best proposals.

 

But that's been changing.

 

The reality is that we are entering a rebuild and that will Continue to become more apparent, and that is something beyond anyone's control, including any of us, myself, or even BT.  The writing is on the wall and the writing should be here too.   The fighting about it doesn't necessarily have to be.   Nor do I think that will last.

 

ok...off to the Oilers thread for me lol.

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