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Realistic Trade suggestions for improvement

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I like the way Gallagher plays but has he not been ridiculously injury prone? I think I’d stay away from him because of that. 

 

The Senators are in an interesting position. I’m thinking theyre looking to retool quickly (with the acquisition of Duchene) - and have more interest in players/prospects than picks. 

 

Mark Stone is due up for a contract at the end of this year. I haven’t heard his name on the trade front, but, we should inquire if he’s available and for what price. He’s a right handed shot, RW, can put the puck in the net, and is 6’3” to boot. It doesn’t hurt that his brother is on our team. What do you all think it would take?

 

On the flip side, Hoffman is interesting. With his speed and shooting ability, he almost seems like a great fit for that Connor guy up north. If we can’t pry stone out of Ottawa, maybe we send our Stone brother to Ottawa in a trade for Hoffman (Ottawa did get rid of Phaneuf already and may see value in bringing in a top 4 RS D man while uniting the Stone brothers). Maybe Versteeg’s can slot in for Hoffman in Ottawa, and then toss them a prospect as well. Adding Hoffman not only gives us a potential boost in goals for, it could also benefit us keeping him away from our enemies to the north. 

 

Someone else mentioned Kyrou from the blues. I like him as well. I doubt St Loo would go for it, but with a package surrounding Lazar and a prospect or roster player (can I use Versteeg again? Or could they use a salary-retained Troy Brouwer type to replace the playoff grit that left with Backes?) what say all of you?

 

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19 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

I like the way Gallagher plays but has he not been ridiculously injury prone? I think I’d stay away from him because of that. 

 

 

Not totally fair I would say. He's been hurt in 2 of his 5 seasons one of which was a broken wrist which is a bit of a fluke injury. He's missed time for sure but not do to anything re occurring or consistent so i'm not sure it's fair to call him injury prone. With the style he plays and his size he is open to more injuries but I'd still chalk it up to mostly some bad luck. 

 

19 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

Mark Stone is due up for a contract at the end of this year. I haven’t heard his name on the trade front, but, we should inquire if he’s available and for what price. He’s a right handed shot, RW, can put the puck in the net, and is 6’3” to boot. It doesn’t hurt that his brother is on our team. What do you all think it would take?

 

 

What would you want if you traded Johnny Gaudreau? Because the price tag would be pretty similar for what Sens would want for Stone. I don't think Stone goes anywhere honestly unless you give up a boat load. 

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I am starting to think that if we want one of Hoffman, Galchenyuk or Pacioretty that we probably have to give up at least one of Bennett, Valimaki, Andersson, Dube, Gillies, Parsons, Fox,  especially if we don't want to use any high draft picks, which we do the have a ton of the next 2 drafts.

 

Out those Valimaki is probably the closest to untouchable for me, I think he is a no doubt top 4 defenseman and will be that very soon, the rest are good players but they certainly have more questions around them.

 

I like Pacioretty a lot as a player, but I think Montreal is looking for a center in return for him, so unless they see Bennett as a center I am not sure our trade assets match up with Montreal. 

 

I am little less keen on Hoffman as a player all around, but as a skilled skater and sniper I like him a lot, I do like that he does have 2 more seasons under contract and that makes giving up one of our prospects easier to stomach.

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2 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

I am starting to think that if we want one of Hoffman, Galchenyuk or Pacioretty that we probably have to give up at least one of Bennett, Valimaki, Andersson, Dube, Gillies, Parsons, Fox,  especially if we don't want to use any high draft picks, which we do the have a ton of the next 2 drafts.

 

The only one of those I would trade is Gillies, because of the waiver situation we'll again find ourselves in next season with three goalies. The only decent roster player I would trade is Stone, and only to Ottawa to play with his brother (because he so recently signed with us). I am not against using next years' 1st round pick.

 

I wonder what that 1st, Kylington, and Gillies gets you...

 

I don't think anything of import will happen. We just don't have the pieces and I'd rather stick it out for a few years until the above internally improves our group.

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I would rather not use next years 1st rounder.  I personally believe you shouldn't give up your 1st rounder two years in a row, as you need a steady stream of young talent ready to step up on entry level deals in the salary cap world.  

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14 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

I am starting to think that if we want one of Hoffman, Galchenyuk or Pacioretty that we probably have to give up at least one of Bennett, Valimaki, Andersson, Dube, Gillies, Parsons, Fox,  especially if we don't want to use any high draft picks, which we do the have a ton of the next 2 drafts.

 

Out those Valimaki is probably the closest to untouchable for me, I think he is a no doubt top 4 defenseman and will be that very soon, the rest are good players but they certainly have more questions around them.

 

I like Pacioretty a lot as a player, but I think Montreal is looking for a center in return for him, so unless they see Bennett as a center I am not sure our trade assets match up with Montreal. 

 

I am little less keen on Hoffman as a player all around, but as a skilled skater and sniper I like him a lot, I do like that he does have 2 more seasons under contract and that makes giving up one of our prospects easier to stomach.

I would start with Bennett and Stone for Hoffman, go from there. Hoffman allows us to do a number of things line wise and is more advanced than Bennett. Stone could be a piece that helps with other decisions for OTT. With Stone gone we can advance Andersson this season.

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My best case was Kylington and Gilles would get you close on Hoffman. I think you might need a 3rd piece, shouldn't be an important one,  but I think you are in the ball park. The downside with Pacioretty is I think his price tag will be higher than that. Despite being a better player I just don't think it makes sense for the Flames to pay that for a guy who will almost certainly only be here this year and next and then walk as  UFA because I don't think the Flames are going to be able to afford him especially given how expensive Tkachuk is going to be. 

 

The 2019 first rounder is off limits for me. I'm not interest in the Flames going back to the Sutter days when they don't have a steady stream of prospects that can compete for jobs. I understand the math and the numbers that first rounders only work out X amount of the time but that is not a philosophy I buy into. I think you always have to be adding to your pipeline and given that the Flames basically won't draft at all this year you simply cannot do that 2 years in a row. 

 

I think Kylington and Gilles is a fair starting point for Hoffman but that all depends on how Ottawa views Gilles. I think Gillies is going to play int he league but he may not be a start he may more of a rotational guy and if Ottawa agrees that obviously lowers his trade value. That being said, they are incredibly shallow in goal and it isn't always easy to find goalies with Gillies size and athleticism. The fact TSN mentions him on their trade bait board and in insider reports suggests to me he carries some value across the league.

 

I'm comfortable with the idea of moving Kylington and Gillies for Hoffman pending what that 3rd piece would be. Hoffman is still my ideal fit. 

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2 minutes ago, ABC923 said:

I would rather not use next years 1st rounder.  I personally believe you shouldn't give up your 1st rounder two years in a row, as you need a steady stream of young talent ready to step up on entry level deals in the salary cap world.  

Agreed. If you are putting Bennett in the deal you are essentially giving them a 1st rounder.

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4 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I'm comfortable with the idea of moving Kylington and Gillies for Hoffman pending what that 3rd piece would be. Hoffman is still my ideal fit. 

 

Geeze I hope you're right. Prospects just never seem hold hold as much value around the trade deadline so I'm not as convinced that those two puts you close on a productive player under contract for two more seasons.

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I keep circling back to Zuccarello.

I mentioned earlier my worry was 2 small wingers centered by Monahan as he plays small. Now I'm wondering if those 2 cantered by Backlund might not work. @ least 2 of the 3 would be aware that defense isn't only for the D-men.

As to the return to the Rags I'd start with Fox (largely because of the unknown on if he'll even sign with the Flames)  & Stone because NYR will need D to replace the 1s they are trying hard to sell off.

 

I'd be fine moving Monahan down to the 2nd because frankly he's almost as big a disappointment to me as Bennett. When Monahan was drafted he came in all gung-ho about spending the summer watching film of western conference centers in f/offs to get a handle on how to beat them. I thought he'd be a student of the game like Scheifele but if he's still doing that he should be @ better than a 50.7% average. I wish he (& Bennett) had even close to the drive Tkachuk (who I wasn't happy about drafting) shows. Looks like I misread 3 players by over-estimating 2 & under-estimating the 3rd.

 

I wonder if Bennett for Domi is possible. @ least Domi ahows that drive/will to win even in a down year. This "Bennett is still young" excuse has gotten old as he's 21 & in his 4th year in the league. Living in the 'Peg & watching a lot of Jets games I see all these ELC rookie injury callups his age & younger come in & play well both ways. I'm talking kids with a few months of AHL playing dang good hockey regardless of being used on various lines up & down the roster & showing the kind of heart I expected from Bennett.

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19 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

Agreed. If you are putting Bennett in the deal you are essentially giving them a 1st rounder.

Maybe a year or 2 ago that was true. Outside Calgary the bloom has come off that rose & he's seen as an under acheiver/reclaimation project. Kind of like Sven Baertchi or Nail Yakupov.

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6 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said:

Maybe a year or 2 ago that was true. Outside Calgary the bloom has come off that rose & he's seen as an under acheiver/reclaimation project. Kind of like Sven Baertchi or Nail Yakupov.

Perhaps but it depends how deep the knife is going in OTT and them still seeing the potential in Bennett. We may have over shot the expectation here with Bennett but I think his game is improving and to be honest if we had to keep him it may be a good deal we didn't make.

In regards to your comments on Monahan I have to say WOW what were you expecting ?

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27 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said:

I keep circling back to Zuccarello.

I mentioned earlier my worry was 2 small wingers centered by Monahan as he plays small. Now I'm wondering if those 2 cantered by Backlund might not work. @ least 2 of the 3 would be aware that defense isn't only for the D-men.

As to the return to the Rags I'd start with Fox (largely because of the unknown on if he'll even sign with the Flames)  & Stone because NYR will need D to replace the 1s they are trying hard to sell off.

 

I'd be fine moving Monahan down to the 2nd because frankly he's almost as big a disappointment to me as Bennett. When Monahan was drafted he came in all gung-ho about spending the summer watching film of western conference centers in f/offs to get a handle on how to beat them. I thought he'd be a student of the game like Scheifele but if he's still doing that he should be @ better than a 50.7% average. I wish he (& Bennett) had even close to the drive Tkachuk (who I wasn't happy about drafting) shows. Looks like I misread 3 players by over-estimating 2 & under-estimating the 3rd.

 

I wonder if Bennett for Domi is possible. @ least Domi ahows that drive/will to win even in a down year. This "Bennett is still young" excuse has gotten old as he's 21 & in his 4th year in the league. Living in the 'Peg & watching a lot of Jets games I see all these ELC rookie injury callups his age & younger come in & play well both ways. I'm talking kids with a few months of AHL playing dang good hockey regardless of being used on various lines up & down the roster & showing the kind of heart I expected from Bennett.

 

I think those are different situations. Baertschi came in and looked great, playing on adrenaline. Jankowski had looked great too but slowed recently after playing more consistently. 

 

But I am angry about killer instinct on this team.

 

id move Bennett up with Gaudreau and Monahan. 

 

Edited in:

the other thing the ‘Peg has on us is they built and built and developed through the draft. They’re beginning to look built the same way the Lightening have been. The Flames have fast tracked the build and are paying for it in less depth. The Jets kept it slow and steady. Now they have quality pieces in most positions and better players compliment others, elevating each other’s games.

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Sean Monahan this year:

 

9th in goals for Forwards. yes 9th best in the entire league.

28th Most points in the league. Not for centers, the league. 

 

5 on 5 stats /60mins of Ice time for center:

5th in Goals

9th in Points

Mostly top 25-30 too when you look at chances created, corsi etc.

 

Funny enough when you look at the past 3 years he is ahead of Schiefelle in categories like Goals/60, Point/60 etc at 5 on 5. 

 

If the expectation for him was higher than that, then you have a pretty unrealistic expectation.

To think less of a player based on faceoffs when he has production like that, would be one of the more bizarre critiques I've ever heard of. Faceoffs are not near that important. 

 

 

 

 

 

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There are reports that the Rangers want prospects and rosters players and not picks for their players. 

 

I wonder if there is any chance that the Rangers move Zibanejad. He's a RHS C, who is dynamic and skilled. 

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38 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

There are reports that the Rangers want prospects and rosters players and not picks for their players. 

 

I wonder if there is any chance that the Rangers move Zibanejad. He's a RHS C, who is dynamic and skilled. 

 

I like Zibanejad too but he's as untouchable on the Rangers as can be.

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38 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

There are reports that the Rangers want prospects and rosters players and not picks for their players. 

 

I wonder if there is any chance that the Rangers move Zibanejad. He's a RHS C, who is dynamic and skilled. 

I have followed Zibanejad closely this year and you don't make this deal. He is a floater and needs 2 wingers that will do the work and get him the scoring chance. Mind you he is a sniper. I would take Zuccarato's work ethic before considering Zibanejab as it would complement our team better.

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I'd be willing to part with any non-roster defence-men not named Andersson or Valimaki:

I believe that pair will become Top 4 D with the Flames.

Trading Stone after this season should be considered, as I believe that Andersson is ready for 3rd pairing minutes now.

I think that Valimaki will play in Stockton next season, and may be ready for the NHL the following one.

 

It would not surprise me if Treliving is quiet at this upcoming TDL.

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4 hours ago, MAC331 said:

Perhaps but it depends how deep the knife is going in OTT and them still seeing the potential in Bennett. We may have over shot the expectation here with Bennett but I think his game is improving and to be honest if we had to keep him it may be a good deal we didn't make.

In regards to your comments on Monahan I have to say WOW what were you expecting ?

I have high standards. I've mentioned Scheifele but look @ Sean Couturier who spent his 1st 5 seasons keeping the likes of Crosby & Malkin off the scoreboard but this year was allowed to use the offensive skill he showed in junior. He has 5 more points than Monahan in 57 games.

Both show what dedication to keep getting better results in. Monahan seems to have found a comfort zone where the fans love him so sees no need to bust his butt to improve.

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So....Backland at 6 years with a 5.35 AAV. Now that's over with and he's  not going anywhere for a while...what's next?

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4 hours ago, cross16 said:

Faceoffs are not near that important. 

 

 

 

 

 

Starting with the puck rather than defending doesn't matter?

If you say so. :lol:

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6 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said:

Starting with the puck rather than defending doesn't matter?

If you say so. :lol:

 

Tampa and Vegas the league's top 2 teams have faceoff percentages of 47.6 (28th) and 48.9 (22nd) respectively. 

 

Winning faceoffs is great, but it's not the be all and end all.

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5 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said:

Starting with the puck rather than defending doesn't matter?

If you say so. :lol:

 

It used to be talked about a lot more. Until the Devils went the the Stanley Cup finals with the 29th ranked faceoff percentage. It's important, but not critical. Tampa Bay is ranked 29th this season in fact, but I don't think it bothers them very much.

 

I do understand your frustration on why centermen don't perfect their faceoff skills. Still, you have to consider that the guy on the other side of the dot may have perfected his craft as well.

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So with Backlund signed going into next year we have:

 

Gaudreau-Monahan-Ferland

Tkachuk-Backlund-Frolik

Bennett-Jankowski-?

?-Lazar-Brouwer

 

We have guys like Lomberg and Hathway that's can fill that 4th line role. The big hole this year and next is that 3rd line RW. Hopefully we can get that RW at the deadline.

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38 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said:

Starting with the puck rather than defending doesn't matter?

If you say so. :lol:

 

For the top line, winning a faceoff is more important, or their offence is delayed until they have the puck again.

I say that because they are on for about 40% of the goals for.  Lose the faceoff and you may spend the entire shift in your D-zone.

Same for the PP; a win gives you a free setup and time to spend getting shots thorough.

 

I don;t keep track of his splits, but he used to be better in clutch situations and the O-zone.  

 

I do think there are some C's that struggle with the new rules.  

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