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Realistic Trade suggestions for improvement

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6 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

Tkachuk for Nylander is what gets it done not the peanuts you are throwing at it. LOL

 

It won't take Tkachuk for Nylander.  One guy is still on a contract vs a guy who wants to be overpaid.

 

Yet, it's interesting because lots of pending RFA are looking at this Nylander case very closely.  If the Leafs blink and throw Nylander $8-mil-per, then I see more players holding out.  If Nylander doesn't get the money, then fewer players will do it.

 

If Tkachuk finished with 75-point this year, then he could command upwards $8-mil-per.  

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43 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I think Hamonic is probably the closest to a #1 RD they could get.

Okay, so if we are going that way, Hamonic and Stone for Nylander and Marincin.

Hamonic replaces Hainsey on top pair.

Stone replaces Marincin as the extra D.

Throw in Klimmer just to give TO the sense of a win?

 

I know Hamonic has had 2 straight good games but that value is still too little.  I think other teams offer more.  Don't get me wrong, I'd love to get Nylander for Hamonic.

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3 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

It won't take Tkachuk for Nylander.  One guy is still on a contract vs a guy who wants to be overpaid.

 

Yet, it's interesting because lots of pending RFA are looking at this Nylander case very closely.  If the Leafs blink and throw Nylander $8-mil-per, then I see more players holding out.  If Nylander doesn't get the money, then fewer players will do it.

 

If Tkachuk finished with 75-point this year, then he could command upwards $8-mil-per.  

My point is it isn't going to happen with anything we would want to give up so forget it if you aren't putting up Tkachuk. Quit being delusional.

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20 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

My point is it isn't going to happen with anything we would want to give up so forget it if you aren't putting up Tkachuk. Quit being delusional.

 

Oh I agree.  It's going to cost someone we don't want to give up.  Maybe Lindholm straight up for example.  He's on a great contract putting up solid numbers.

 

But at the same time, Nylander has a bit of a negative trade value due to the amount of money he is reportedly seeking.

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3 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Oh I agree.  It's going to cost someone we don't want to give up.  Maybe Lindholm straight up for example.  He's on a great contract putting up solid numbers.

 

But at the same time, Nylander has a bit of a negative trade value due to the amount of money he is reportedly seeking.

Hard to say the team trading for him still as to come to terms with him. I like our team, I just think BP has yet to figure out who needs to be playing with who and where.

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https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey/former-edmonton-oilers-player-iiro-pakarinen-complains-of-lack-of-communication-from-coaches/amp

 

Former Oiler critical of the Oilers communication with him, bascially critical of their development of their players and said Puljujarvi probably got similar treatment.

 

Could we trade for Puljujarvi?  We can rebuild him. We have the technology. We can make him better than he was. Better, stronger, faster.

 

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6 hours ago, The_People1 said:

https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey/former-edmonton-oilers-player-iiro-pakarinen-complains-of-lack-of-communication-from-coaches/amp

 

Former Oiler critical of the Oilers communication with him, bascially critical of their development of their players and said Puljujarvi probably got similar treatment.

 

Could we trade for Puljujarvi?  We can rebuild him. We have the technology. We can make him better than he was. Better, stronger, faster.

 

 

I’d consider it for the right price.  At the moment, most oilers fans would be happy to get a second rounder for him from the sounds of it.  Maybe Stone+Ryan+3rd for JJ and Benning.  Stone would easily slot into their top 4, and Ryan gives them a bit of depth at forward.  Maybe we need to take another salary back besides Benning.

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1 hour ago, ABC923 said:

I’d consider it for the right price.  At the moment, most oilers fans would be happy to get a second rounder for him from the sounds of it.  Maybe Stone+Ryan+3rd for JJ and Benning.  Stone would easily slot into their top 4, and Ryan gives them a bit of depth at forward.  Maybe we need to take another salary back besides Benning.

 

If you watch Benning, he is a project.  No interest in him at all.  Poolparty is one of those guys that could become better on a different team.  The Oilers are disfunctional after the 1st line.  They are at the point where they have to play the $8.5m man with McDavid because nothing is working now.  Their 4th line is the only one that seem to pay for their jobs.  A bunch of spare parts elsewhere.

 

It would be difficult to structure a deal for Poolparty.  For one thing, Chia is reluctant to trade him right now.  For another, the media controls a lot of thought in EDM, so Chia has to appease the fanbase.  Sure the media is a bunch of fanboys that get access by reporting the Oilers party line, but they do at least scrutinize things like how a 3rd overall is being used.  Stone would immesely help their blueline, but that $3.5m is tough for them to fit in.  I believe they have the majority of Sekera's LTIR cap space to go over, but that will eventually evaporate when (if) he comes back.

 

Perhaps adding a pick might soften the blow.  I doubt it.  Stone + Czarnik maybe.    

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10 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

If you watch Benning, he is a project.  No interest in him at all.  Poolparty is one of those guys that could become better on a different team.  The Oilers are disfunctional after the 1st line.  They are at the point where they have to play the $8.5m man with McDavid because nothing is working now.  Their 4th line is the only one that seem to pay for their jobs.  A bunch of spare parts elsewhere.

 

It would be difficult to structure a deal for Poolparty.  For one thing, Chia is reluctant to trade him right now.  For another, the media controls a lot of thought in EDM, so Chia has to appease the fanbase.  Sure the media is a bunch of fanboys that get access by reporting the Oilers party line, but they do at least scrutinize things like how a 3rd overall is being used.  Stone would immesely help their blueline, but that $3.5m is tough for them to fit in.  I believe they have the majority of Sekera's LTIR cap space to go over, but that will eventually evaporate when (if) he comes back.

 

Perhaps adding a pick might soften the blow.  I doubt it.  Stone + Czarnik maybe.    

 

No doubt, I see him as being a cheaper 7th defensman for us and nothing more.  I think Stone is better, but included Benning simply to give us depth defense and to even out some of the salary going the other way.  Outside of Poolparty (which is who I meant when I wrote JJ.  Not sure why I said JJ), I don't see anything of value that could be had from the Oilers.

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6 minutes ago, ABC923 said:

 

No doubt, I see him as being a cheaper 7th defensman for us and nothing more.  I think Stone is better, but included Benning simply to give us depth defense and to even out some of the salary going the other way.  Outside of Poolparty (which is who I meant when I wrote JJ.  Not sure why I said JJ), I don't see anything of value that could be had from the Oilers.

Not that I give two hoots about the Oilers but they should explore a trade with VAN for Tanev. VAN may see some value having Lucic and Puljujarvi, maybe they have to make Lucic less costly. They need a deterrent there for Pettersson to grow.

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I think EDM asks for Bennett in a Puljujarvi trade, which I wouldn't do. Bennett as we have seen can still be a productive player when he is not scoring while Puljujarvi is invisible when he's not finding the net

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46 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I think EDM asks for Bennett in a Puljujarvi trade, which I wouldn't do. Bennett as we have seen can still be a productive player when he is not scoring while Puljujarvi is invisible when he's not finding the net

 

It would probably be a "fair" trade from the aspect of two players that are not meeting original expectations.

Bennett is frustrating as heck.  Gets the defensive side of the game.  Generates chances, but has almost no finish.

Pooly is a great skater, has size, can shoot.....

But, he is a project.  Has not been developed properly.  As confused without the puck as most Oilers forwards.

Sending him to the AHL makes sense for the Oilers because they have no idea how to work with him.

 

If I am trading for him, then it has to start with breaking down the player to the basics.

Stockton might be a good place for him, though they are suffering there this year.

You might be able to keep him on the NHL roster here, as the bottom 6 needs some work.

Besides, he's coming up for a new deal and you need to see what he is.

 

I don't think you trade Bennett to the Oilers.  That would probably come back to haunt us.  Anywhere else, not so much.

He would probably fit with Draisaitl or Nuge.

 

So, the best we can offer is a D-man that fits their needs, retain $1m salary.  Stone is at least as good as Russell, better than Benning.

Of course, I am being generous.  The $1m retained would be cheaper than buying out Stone in the summer.  Like I said, we would need to add something to pique their interest.

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11 hours ago, The_People1 said:

https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey/former-edmonton-oilers-player-iiro-pakarinen-complains-of-lack-of-communication-from-coaches/amp

 

Former Oiler critical of the Oilers communication with him, bascially critical of their development of their players and said Puljujarvi probably got similar treatment.

 

Could we trade for Puljujarvi?  We can rebuild him. We have the technology. We can make him better than he was. Better, stronger, faster.

 

 

This is highly debatable Peeps. If we are doing so poorly with Sam Bennett what makes you think we have the know how to do better with Puljujarvi?

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11 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said:

This is highly debatable Peeps. If we are doing so poorly with Sam Bennett what makes you think we have the know how to do better with Puljujarvi?

 

I think the complaint basically says that they never talked to him to tell him what his goals should be, what he needed to work on, etc.

With Pooly, I don't know what the issue is.  He makes a mistake and gets sat.  There doesn't seem to be coaching of him.

I do think BP is better at that.  We've had trouble graduating prospects over the last few year.  This year, we are running with 3.

And they are getting some rope, because that's the only way you learn.  Make a mistake and coach that out of them.

Perhaps Valimaki could help in some of the learnings.

 

Pooly has value as a top 5 pick.  Bennett has value as a top 5 pick.  Unfortunately, both are losing value and the GM's are getting impatient, at least it seems that way.  

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On 11/11/2018 at 11:09 AM, MAC331 said:

I disagree and don't see any urgency to trade Stone. BP is playing the defensemen that should be playing and as you say Stone is good required depth. So long as BT is monitoring the league there may be an opportunity that arises to trade Stone but why force something.

 

It's simple. If we are wasting cap for two more seasons on a bottom line/pair player who is spending most of their time in the press box I would rather spend 2 instead of 3.5. 

 

I am not bullish on the trade. Stone is a more functional NHL player. If they could trade him for something better then fine. Keeping him isn't terrible. But with Valimaki and Andersson full time and Kylington ready we don't need him. I think Kassian is an upgrade on Hathaway and definitely an upgrade on Prout/Peluso. 

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4 hours ago, kehatch said:

 

It's simple. If we are wasting cap for two more seasons on a bottom line/pair player who is spending most of their time in the press box I would rather spend 2 instead of 3.5. 

 

I am not bullish on the trade. Stone is a more functional NHL player. If they could trade him for something better then fine. Keeping him isn't terrible. But with Valimaki and Andersson full time and Kylington ready we don't need him. I think Kassian is an upgrade on Hathaway and definitely an upgrade on Prout/Peluso. 

I agree with everything you said right up to the Kassian part. Can't stand him and don't want him anywhere near this team. Hathaway plays his role just fine and with Czarnik around for a different look on the 4th line we are fine.

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6 hours ago, DirtyDeeds said:

This is highly debatable Peeps. If we are doing so poorly with Sam Bennett what makes you think we have the know how to do better with Puljujarvi?

 

The Oilers did so well with McDavid that they probably didn't screw up Puljujarvi and he simply is a bust.

 

Or we've done a decent job with Monahan, Gaudreau, Andersson, Valimaki, etc.... The argument can go both ways.

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8 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I think EDM asks for Bennett in a Puljujarvi trade, which I wouldn't do. Bennett as we have seen can still be a productive player when he is not scoring while Puljujarvi is invisible when he's not finding the net

 

I wouldn't do Bennett either.  

 

What about Jankowski?  I personally wouldn't but we find Jankowski as a 4th liner with our C depth.  Is that a waste?  Would it be better served for us to have a potential game breaking RHS RW in Puljujarvi?  We could develop Puljujarvi in the minors as someone else steps into Jankowski's 4th line role.

 

What about Andersson?  I personally wouldn't because he is showing top 3 potential.  But Oilers would definitely want RHS RD who can flash top 3.

 

What if Neal?  Is this a chance to cut bait with a potentially disgruntled forward who isn't getting first line minutes as originally "promised".  Neal has disappointed thus far.  Maybe EDM is where he should go to continue disappointing?  EDM has such pressure to make the playoffs this year or Chia gets fired.  They would want a Vet like Neal who could play top line RW.

 

What if Frolik? Chance to cut cap on what many see as a redundant player and too expensive to keep on the 3rd line... Basically Frolik is a luxury we may no longer be able to afford after Tkachuk's pending big raise.  He has value on an Oilers team looking to add 2/3rd line depth/versatility.

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12 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I wouldn't do Bennett either.  

 

What about Jankowski?  I personally wouldn't but we find Jankowski as a 4th liner with our C depth.  Is that a waste?  Would it be better served for us to have a potential game breaking RHS RW in Puljujarvi?  We could develop Puljujarvi in the minors as someone else steps into Jankowski's 4th line role.

 

What about Andersson?  I personally wouldn't because he is showing top 3 potential.  But Oilers would definitely want RHS RD who can flash top 3.

 

What if Neal?  Is this a chance to cut bait with a potentially disgruntled forward who isn't getting first line minutes as originally "promised".  Neal has disappointed thus far.  Maybe EDM is where he should go to continue disappointing?  EDM has such pressure to make the playoffs this year or Chia gets fired.  They would want a Vet like Neal who could play top line RW.

 

What if Frolik? Chance to cut cap on what many see as a redundant player and too expensive to keep on the 3rd line... Basically Frolik is a luxury we may no longer be able to afford after Tkachuk's pending big raise.  He has value on an Oilers team looking to add 2/3rd line depth/versatility.

Those are interesting suggestions.

 

The only issue and I while I know what guys make thanks to capfriendly, I don’t know the in’s and outs if the cap. Since EDM has Sekera on LTIR they are getting relief but since he will be playing at some point this season they will lose that relief at which point I believe they will only have a few hundred thousand of cap space. I think Janko or Andersson would work for them, but Frolík or Neal would have to be part of a larger blockbuster deal 

 

Anyway, I remember the 2016 draft. I badly wanted us to draft Puljujarvi. And if I remember correctly there were rumours we tried to get to 3rd OA in a deal with EDM and CBJ that would have seen Sergachev to EDM, Dubois to the Jackets and us getting Puljujarvi. Of course the deal fell through as there were concerns VAN wanted Dubois at 5 if he was available. Anyway it was for the best as we have a heck of a player and it couldn’t have turned out worse for EDM lol

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20 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Those are interesting suggestions.

 

The only issue and I while I know what guys make thanks to capfriendly, I don’t know the in’s and outs if the cap. Since EDM has Sekera on LTIR they are getting relief but since he will be playing at some point this season they will lose that relief at which point I believe they will only have a few hundred thousand of cap space. I think Janko or Andersson would work for them, but Frolík or Neal would have to be part of a larger blockbuster deal 

 

Anyway, I remember the 2016 draft. I badly wanted us to draft Puljujarvi. And if I remember correctly there were rumours we tried to get to 3rd OA in a deal with EDM and CBJ that would have seen Sergachev to EDM, Dubois to the Jackets and us getting Puljujarvi. Of course the deal fell through as there were concerns VAN wanted Dubois at 5 if he was available. Anyway it was for the best as we have a heck of a player and it couldn’t have turned out worse for EDM lol

 

After that draft, BT said he wanted to trade up to get Tkachuk at 3rd... But I don't know if that's just fake news because what else is a GM to say after the draft.

 

The rumor was, MTL wanted the French kid Dubois and was offering Subban.  CBJ was stacked with young D so didn't bite.  The Oilers thought they'd get the chance to draft Dubois at 4th. They were sitting pretty until rumor was CBJ, a Finnish GM was, critical of Puljujarvi so EDM thought CBJ would draft Dubois and the whole scene at the draft floor got crazy.  The Oilers never really wanted Puljujarvi.  They wanted Subban.  But they took Puljujarvi anyways.  The Flames probably wanted one of Tkachuk or Puljujarvi and BT thought that would never happen at 6th but VAN did us a favour.

 

I wonder if now is the perfect time to get Puljujarvi.  He's still young.  It's not too late as a reclamation project and the ceiling is very high.

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3 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

After that draft, BT said he wanted to trade up to get Tkachuk at 3rd... But I don't know if that's just fake news because what else is a GM to say after the draft.

 

The rumor was, MTL wanted the French kid Dubois and was offering Subban.  CBJ was stacked with young D so didn't bite.  The Oilers thought they'd get the chance to draft Dubois at 4th. They were sitting pretty until rumor was CBJ, a Finnish GM was, critical of Puljujarvi so EDM thought CBJ would draft Dubois and the whole scene at the draft floor got crazy.  The Oilers never really wanted Puljujarvi.  They wanted Subban.  But they took Puljujarvi anyways.  The Flames probably wanted one of Tkachuk or Puljujarvi and BT thought that would never happen at 6th but VAN did us a favour.

 

I wonder if now is the perfect time to get Puljujarvi.  He's still young.  It's not too late as a reclamation project and the ceiling is very high.

 

I remember thinking BT was targeting Puljujarvi as well.

TBH, I heard nothing of Subban being offered for the 3rd, IIRC, they wanted Nurse as part of any Subban deal.  Maybe that plus the 4th overall.

I think BT was trying to get ahead of VAN just to ensure they got Tkachuk.  It was either going to be EDM or CBJ to ensure it.

But, like you, I was surprised that BT had been trying to deal for the 3rd for Tkachuk.

 

Chia was trying to deal to get the 3rd as well, but for some reason CBJ just opted to take Dubois at 3rd.  In hindsite, it looks like a decent pick over Pooly.

Just didn;t understand why they didn;t charge EDM at least for that pick.  I can understand why they wouldn;t trade with us.

 

Ya know, I was a bit miffed that EDM got Pooly.  I think he can become a pretty decent player.  Just not there.  There is nobody that fits with him except maybe McDavid.

That ain't happening.  I wonder if Czarnik and Stone would be a reasonable offer?  We can't seem to figure out what to do with him.  I think he would do well there, and I believe they were also interested in him.  It would be a shame, but I don't know if there is anything else of value we could offer.

 

Bennett would not be a good idea, though I am beginning to think he will not even break out this year.

Andersson is a non-starter for me.

Same for Brodie and Hammer.

Frolik is what they need, but worth a lot to the Flames.  Best defensive player we have.

Janko probably wouldn;t help them, since they have little useful depth that could play with him.

Ryan would not make sense to Chia, but would be the kind of player they could use. 

Dube for Poolparty?  Probably somewhat equal in value.  

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22 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

 

I wonder if now is the perfect time to get Puljujarvi.  He's still young.  It's not too late as a reclamation project and the ceiling is very high.

Wonder if Czarnik would be a player of interest to EDM. Problem is EDM will look at draft status, JP 4th overall pick and Czarnik an undrafted guy who is a bit older than JP. But Czarnik 21 points in 70 career games, Puljujarvi 28 points in 93 career games. I'd also argue that JP has been given more opportunity to play with skilled players than Czarnik has and really hasn't done much with it. Another thing is EDM is in cap-hell, having Czarnik at 1.25 for next year could be very good for them as IMO he is a better player than Rattie and could fit on that top line

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Pulljarvi to Calgary is very unlikely. One, we don't a struggling winger. Two, deals for these types of players rarely happens between rivals. It does happen (ie Baertschi) but it's rare and only when there stent other options. Chances are Edmonton has options. 

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Is Pulijarvi able to go to the minors?

 

i think this was the problem we had with Bennett. They burned a year, he had a decent year, and then needed to develop and had unrealistic expectations placed on him where he should’ve learned the C game in the minors. 

 

There is only so much learning a player can get in the NHL. What I mean is, the NHL is not meant to be a developmental league. Players need a certain minimum skill in order to stay up. Bennett has always been on the cusp so they kept him up. Plus it isn’t customary to do that. 

 

I guess it it could be easier to place Pulijarvi in the minors if on a different team. Edmonton is at a place of no return as they burnt the proverbial minors bridge much like the Flames did with Bennett.

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The only trade I think we need to address is with goaltending.  We don’t need another “project “ like Pulijarvi-anyone remember Lazar?!  If we need more right side depth, play Jankowski there.  He played that a number of times in the minors, and when he’s been with players from the top line, stuff happens.

 Moving Neal to the top line to “jumpstart “ his scoring is ridiculous IMO.  To me it’s rewarding complacency. Neal has to make things happen at any given line, with the time he’s given, to get the reward of bumping someone down, who is being successful on a particular line.

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