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Realistic Trade suggestions for improvement

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14 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

I don't know why, but I have this sneaking suspicion that Chris Kreider is going to be one of Treliving's top targets this off season. We need to get bigger and faster and he checks both of those boxes. I did find it interesting that Kreider and Gaudreau were put on a line a the World Championships, with both taking turns on the right side. To add to that Chris Drury was the GM of Team USA and is also the AGM of the Rangers, so maybe there was a little bit of a showcase there.

 

It would probably cost a 1st plus a prospect like Kylington to get the deal done, but I could see them being interested in Brodie as they don't exactly have a strong defense. 

 

They love them some Flames defense.

Fox may be considered to be in their top 6, but they need to be deeper than that.

Brodie for Kreider straight up?

Reasonably fair for both sides.

 

Then again, we have traded Brodie about 5 different times.

If we were shopping Brodie and something else for Trouba, I would be happy.

 

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2 hours ago, GM_3300 said:

Anointing Mangiapane the next Marty St.Louis is getting way ahead of the situation. He played 44 games with 8 goals and 5 assists. One could list any number of high scoring Juniors that fail over time in the NHL. Do I think he will fail not really but to buy into the claims floating around here is getting ridiculous for a player with 1/2 an NHL season.

He could have value here and he could have perceived value within a trade for a further advanced player.

 

Lol easy bro.  Saying Mangiapane is a 20 to 30 goal scorer is not the same as Martin St.Louis 100-point season.  It's just saying he's a capable 2nd line LW who can spot duty the top line from time to time.

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2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Who said anything about MSL.  The fact that some people want to trade him before he plays a full season is more concerning.

He score 8 playing mostly limited minutes.

With 4th line players.

 

His perceived value is very low, since he is only a 1st year player with limited results.

He's not a C, nor a defensive standout.

Crazy to consider trading him at this point.

You would receive little value.

 

As far as his ceiling, compare him for a minute to Bennett.

He played 77 games and scored 18 goals in his best year, playing a lot of top 6 minutes.

If Bennett's stats improved from that year, he would be a top 6 player today.

If a full season of Mangiapane is 18 goals (not a stretch from his end of season results), then that's far from his perceived value today.

 

Mange and Bennett are very different players.  One has focused on grit to make up for lack of finish.  The other has focused on learning how to come out of the dirty areas with the puck and get a shot away.  

If a deal comes along that involves Mangiapane and we upgrade another position of need so be it. I have seen us trade better players than him early like MSL and Brett Hull too.

You can carry the argument between him and Bennett if you like, it isn't about comparing those two but I will take what Bennett's game is becoming now if a choice was to be made. If no choice is necessary they could be good line mates on the 3rd line.

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Alright time to suggest something crazy.

 

I think we should offer sheet Laine. Laine had a down season, but how many players in this league have his combination of size, skill, and shot. I mean imagine Gaudreau and Laine on a line together.

 

We would have to give up our next 4 1st round picks, which would hurt, but we be getting one of the best goal scorers in the league, and those picks would be late 1st round picks anyways.

 

There would have to be some fancy cap negotiating to get it done. 

 

Winnipeg might match it but it would really mess them up. 

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1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

Alright time to suggest something crazy.

 

I think we should offer sheet Laine. Laine had a down season, but how many players in this league have his combination of size, skill, and shot. I mean imagine Gaudreau and Laine on a line together.

 

We would have to give up our next 4 1st round picks, which would hurt, but we be getting one of the best goal scorers in the league, and those picks would be late 1st round picks anyways.

 

There would have to be some fancy cap negotiating to get it done. 

 

Winnipeg might match it but it would really mess them up. 

Laine isn't worth 10.5 million, which is what you would have to pay him to need to give up 4 1st rounders.  That would wreck our cap structure, and torpedo our development pipeline.  He might be worth 8.5 though, which comes with a 2 1st + 1 2nd + 1 3rd cost, but even then I think that is pushing it.  He probably signs for something like 6X8M, which carries a cost of 1st + 2nd + 3rd.  If I thought the Flames could shed the salary to sign both him and Tkachuk at that price, I'd be all over it, but Jets probably match anything under that 10.5 rate I reckon, and deal with figuring out their cap later.

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1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

Alright time to suggest something crazy.

 

I think we should offer sheet Laine. Laine had a down season, but how many players in this league have his combination of size, skill, and shot. I mean imagine Gaudreau and Laine on a line together.

 

We would have to give up our next 4 1st round picks, which would hurt, but we be getting one of the best goal scorers in the league, and those picks would be late 1st round picks anyways.

 

There would have to be some fancy cap negotiating to get it done. 

 

Winnipeg might match it but it would really mess them up. 

 

We should focus on Centers.

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23 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

We should focus on Centers.

 

You are right.

 

We should offer sheet Sebastian Aho or Brayden Point.

 

 

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3 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Lol easy bro.  Saying Mangiapane is a 20 to 30 goal scorer is not the same as Martin St.Louis 100-point season.  It's just saying he's a capable 2nd line LW who can spot duty the top line from time to time.

I didn't say he was a 20 to 30 goal scorer nor do I think he close to playing top 6 as a regular yet if ever other than spot fill ins. He has a ways to go yet.

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14 hours ago, JTech780 said:

Alright time to suggest something crazy.

 

I think we should offer sheet Laine. Laine had a down season, but how many players in this league have his combination of size, skill, and shot. I mean imagine Gaudreau and Laine on a line together.

 

We would have to give up our next 4 1st round picks, which would hurt, but we be getting one of the best goal scorers in the league, and those picks would be late 1st round picks anyways.

 

There would have to be some fancy cap negotiating to get it done. 

 

Winnipeg might match it but it would really mess them up. 

You're right, that is something crazy, and certainly won't and shouldn't happen. I've seen almost every Jets game last year and his defensive game is woeful, his d-game and backchecking leaves alot to be desired, basically I see a one trick pony. Yes it's a hell of a trick but the streakiness is concerning.

 

The Jets wont be offering him Marner/Tkachuk money so I think they'll offer a short, possible 3 year  "prove it" deal, which is probably the best for both parties. With the surge of Kyle Conner who also needs to be paid while putting up better #'s management isn't going to be too generous with #29.

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1 hour ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

You're right, that is something crazy, and certainly won't and shouldn't happen. I've seen almost every Jets game last year and his defensive game is woeful, his d-game and backchecking leaves alot to be desired, basically I see a one trick pony. Yes it's a hell of a trick but the streakiness is concerning.

 

The Jets wont be offering Marner/Tkachuk money so I think they'll offer a short, possible 3 year  "prove it" deal, which is probably the best for both parties. With the surge of Kyle Conner who also needs to be paid while putting up better #'s management isn't going to be too generous with #29.

it was a dark and stormy night.. many many years ago when the Calgary Flames started this ridiculous salary escalation that led to the current salary cap.. Think back.. waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay back.. when Calgary offer sheeted Teemu Selanne... . Fool me once.. shame on you.. fool me twice.. shame on me!!!

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On the newest Bobcast, Bob McKenzie stated they we are looking to move one of Brodie or Hamonic. Earth shattering news right.

 

This is the first time though that I have seen Hamonic's name other than on the Trade Bait board.

 

I do wonder if we can get a similar package as what LA got for Muzzin. A 1st and 2 prospects who were former 2nd round prospects.

 

I would say we would get slightly less, just based on the fact that Toronto got a couple extra months from Muzzin, but I think it should be close.

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3 hours ago, JTech780 said:

On the newest Bobcast, Bob McKenzie stated they we are looking to move one of Brodie or Hamonic. Earth shattering news right.

 

This is the first time though that I have seen Hamonic's name other than on the Trade Bait board.

 

I do wonder if we can get a similar package as what LA got for Muzzin. A 1st and 2 prospects who were former 2nd round prospects.

 

I would say we would get slightly less, just based on the fact that Toronto got a couple extra months from Muzzin, but I think it should be close.

 

Maybe it's because Brodie has no trade value.  

 

He doesn't even have value with us anymore.  He has to pair with Giordano or else he's below average.  What good is he then?  Everyone looks good with Giordano.

 

Hamonic stands up for our players and although he's not a great fighter, it's the message that counts.  If we lose him then we lose a big part of our team's message.  Only Hamonic and Bennett are willing to drop their gloves in an instant to defend our players.

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11 hours ago, JTech780 said:

On the newest Bobcast, Bob McKenzie stated they we are looking to move one of Brodie or Hamonic. Earth shattering news right.

 

This is the first time though that I have seen Hamonic's name other than on the Trade Bait board.

 

I do wonder if we can get a similar package as what LA got for Muzzin. A 1st and 2 prospects who were former 2nd round prospects.

 

I would say we would get slightly less, just based on the fact that Toronto got a couple extra months from Muzzin, but I think it should be close.

Maybe Brodie has almost no trade value, but oh man that’s a tough look trading Hamonic already. Seeing as though we are still technically “paying off” the Hamonic trade as we owe NYI our 2nd this year and gave up the chance to draft a stud in Dobson, it’s a bad look after only 2 years of Hamonic

 

It also creates a much larger hole than trading Brodie, whom I believe could be replaced in-house with Valimaki only getting better every year. Hamonic brings an element of toughness to the backend that nobody else does on this team. It would also leave us with only Andersson

as the only viable RHD on the roster. All those assets spent to acquire Hamilton and Hamonic and both are out in 3 seasons and 2 seasons respectively...

 

All things being equal (which they aren’t), in normal circumstances I could support a Hamonic trade from the standpoint of I think he won’t age very well as a player, given how rugged and hard he plays. Brodie likely remains the same type of player for the remainder of his career. It’s just I don’t think the optics of a Hamonic trade are great for the Flames, they gave up so much to get him and now with only one year of term left I get see them getting much that moves the needle going forward 

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You can't let part trades impact future trades. You have to make the best trade regardless. 

 

I think you throw both players names so you can cast a wider net and see you can find out what your best trade options are. 

 

Maybe the Islanders are more interested in Hamonic than Brodie, and they are willing to move the 23rd overall pick plus Mitchel Vande Sompel and Michael Dal Colle. I think you would have to take a long look at that trade.

 

Maybe the Rangers are willing to move the 20th overall pick and the rights to Buchnevich for Brodie. Again you would have to take a long at that trade.

 

Treliving is just trying to figure out what his best options are.

 

I think we can probably get a late 1st for either player, can we get anything else on top?

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1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

You can't let part trades impact future trades. You have to make the best trade regardless. 

 

I think you throw both players names so you can cast a wider net and see you can find out what your best trade options are. 

 

Maybe the Islanders are more interested in Hamonic than Brodie, and they are willing to move the 23rd overall pick plus Mitchel Vande Sompel and Michael Dal Colle. I think you would have to take a long look at that trade.

 

Maybe the Rangers are willing to move the 20th overall pick and the rights to Buchnevich for Brodie. Again you would have to take a long at that trade.

 

Treliving is just trying to figure out what his best options are.

 

I think we can probably get a late 1st for either player, can we get anything else on top?

I think a late first is a possibility for either guy, but with only a single year on each contract we might not get it.  I do agree though, both names are out there just to see where the best value for us is.  Would we rather trade Brodie? Probably, but maybe Hamonic gets you a better return.  My gut says Brodie is the one to be moved, and with Zaitsev requesting a trade out of Toronto (assuming they can move him), they will be even more desperate to add defensive depth on both sides.

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58 minutes ago, ABC923 said:

I think a late first is a possibility for either guy, but with only a single year on each contract we might not get it.  I do agree though, both names are out there just to see where the best value for us is.  Would we rather trade Brodie? Probably, but maybe Hamonic gets you a better return.  My gut says Brodie is the one to be moved, and with Zaitsev requesting a trade out of Toronto (assuming they can move him), they will be even more desperate to add defensive depth on both sides.

 

LA got a 1st and 2 prospects for 3 months and 1 year of Muzzin. I think Brodie and Hamonic carry similar value to Muzzin.

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How do y’all rank Hamonic vs Trouba?

 

Since Hamonic’s name is out there, and there was speculation he originally wanted to go to Winnipeg when on the Islanders, does a swap of both players make sense? I’ll admit, I haven’t paid attention to Trouba much. 

 

If Trouba is a suitable swap for Hamonic, I think that still leaves the door open to trade Brodie. Then again, we’d also be left to see how Hanafin and Trouba mesh as a pairing. 

 

 

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44 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

How do y’all rank Hamonic vs Trouba?

 

Since Hamonic’s name is out there, and there was speculation he originally wanted to go to Winnipeg when on the Islanders, does a swap of both players make sense? I’ll admit, I haven’t paid attention to Trouba much. 

 

If Trouba is a suitable swap for Hamonic, I think that still leaves the door open to trade Brodie. Then again, we’d also be left to see how Hanafin and Trouba mesh as a pairing. 

 

 

 

I really like Trouba, he is just about everything you would want in a top pairing guy, he is big, he can skate, he can play mean, he is RHS.

 

To get Trouba it would most likely cost Hamonic, Our 1st, and a prospect like Dube or Kylington.

 

The there is the fact that he needs a new contract. He can probably command in the range of $8mx8 years. It would be hard for us to fit that cap hit in.

 

Again I would love to get Trouba here, between the acquisition cost and the cost of the contract, I just don't know how realistic it is.

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this trade sets both teams up nicely

to TOR

Harmonic RD

Brodie     LD/RD

 

to CGY

 

Gauthier C

Kapanen RW

Zaitsev LD  (Trade him and bring back Engelland)

 

 

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4 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

I really like Trouba, he is just about everything you would want in a top pairing guy, he is big, he can skate, he can play mean, he is RHS.

 

To get Trouba it would most likely cost Hamonic, Our 1st, and a prospect like Dube or Kylington.

 

The there is the fact that he needs a new contract. He can probably command in the range of $8mx8 years. It would be hard for us to fit that cap hit in.

 

Again I would love to get Trouba here, between the acquisition cost and the cost of the contract, I just don't know how realistic it is.

 

Oh wow. I didn’t think the price tag would be that expensive. I knew he’d need a new contract, but so will hamonic and Brodie after next season. The cost of acquisition and a new contract sounds like a non-starter...

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I think a Trouba trade is possible, but you have to have the understanding that it's likely for one year and then he's gone. I liken this to the Raptors and Leonard, I get that it's not the best example but, Trouba will really help the Flames, but most likely for one season. But if it gets you a deep playoff run it's worth it.

 

 

Also I believe the rumor isTrouba's father isn't able to cross the border, which is a reason he hasn't signed longterm with the Jets, we'd be in the same boat as the Jets

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39 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Also I believe the rumor isTrouba's father isn't able to cross the border, which is a reason he hasn't signed longterm with the Jets, we'd be in the same boat as the Jets

 

If this is true, he shouldn’t be a consideration. That would be poor asset management.

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1 hour ago, lou44291 said:

 

If this is true, he shouldn’t be a consideration. That would be poor asset management.

Could just be a rumour, but I do find it peculiar that he hasn’t signed long-term on a team that’s extremely well built and looks to compete for Cups the next 5 seasons.

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18 hours ago, redfire11 said:

this trade sets both teams up nicely

to TOR

Harmonic RD

Brodie     LD/RD

 

to CGY

 

Gauthier C

Kapanen RW

Zaitsev LD  (Trade him and bring back Engelland)

 

 

I would propose to TOR  Brodie and Stone (50%) for Kapanen RW and Zaitsev RD forget Gauthier. I think Zaitsev would be renewed playing with Giordano. I like the idea of Andersson and Valimaki playing as a pairing to grow together.

BTW I would expect Engelland to retire this offseason.

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22 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

I really like Trouba, he is just about everything you would want in a top pairing guy, he is big, he can skate, he can play mean, he is RHS.

 

To get Trouba it would most likely cost Hamonic, Our 1st, and a prospect like Dube or Kylington.

 

The there is the fact that he needs a new contract. He can probably command in the range of $8mx8 years. It would be hard for us to fit that cap hit in.

 

Again I would love to get Trouba here, between the acquisition cost and the cost of the contract, I just don't know how realistic it is.

 

I think there are few teams that could afford the asking price.  

EDM doesn;t have the top 4 D to send and they can;t afford the salary.

ARI could afford the salary, but doesn;t have the pieces to send back.

TOR has less cap space than them and Kadri/Kapanen for Trouba helps neither team with that.

FLA could probably swing it, but they don;t have a D to give up.

 

So few teams are willing to give up a top 4 D to get a top 4 D.

 

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