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Realistic Trade suggestions for improvement

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23 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Could just be a rumour, but I do find it peculiar that he hasn’t signed long-term on a team that’s extremely well built and looks to compete for Cups the next 5 seasons.

One of the issues was he didn't want to be 2nd pairing behind Buff on the right side. When Buff was hurt he took over #1 RD and did very well.  I don't think it's as much of a Canadian/American thing as much as it is being the Top D-man with top minutes. There's still a black cloud over him around these parts, he won't be back.

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13 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

 

 

Flyers pick #11. 

 

Should we be interested?

 

Unfortunately it would cost us something like Gaudreau, Monahan, Lindholm or Tkachuk.

 

I mean Monahan for the 11th and Nolan Patrick might get me interested, but it could easily backfire for us as well.

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I always take sources with a grain of salt, but if there is any truth to this , I'd be all over it 

 

If we can do the extension first , then Id have no trouble going as high as Johnny.. but if we can get him cheaper as an unsigned player, then it opens up a world of other possibilities

Especially since he seems to have grown up , I have long thought he'd be a perfect fit here

 

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/breaking-taylor-hall-may-be-done-in-new-jersey

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9 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

Unfortunately it would cost us something like Gaudreau, Monahan, Lindholm or Tkachuk.

 

I mean Monahan for the 11th and Nolan Patrick might get me interested, but it could easily backfire for us as well.

I would say for 11th overall Chuck is dreaming if he thinks he's getting something that good.. not sure what Id give for it , but probably something in the mold of Dube and swap firsts 

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16 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

I always take sources with a grain of salt, but if there is any truth to this , I'd be all over it 

 

If we can do the extension first , then Id have no trouble going as high as Johnny.. but if we can get him cheaper as an unsigned player, then it opens up a world of other possibilities

Especially since he seems to have grown up , I have long thought he'd be a perfect fit here

 

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/breaking-taylor-hall-may-be-done-in-new-jersey

 

I don't see a fit for Hall. I wouldn't trade Gaudreau for him. They put up similar point totals, but Gaudreau makes the players around him much better, Hall doesn't. Monahan needs a top end playmaking winger to be truly effective, that isn't Hall's game, so Monahan would most likely take a step backwards. Hall is also very prone to injuries.

 

Even if we didn't trade for him and he signed here, we wouldn't have the cap space to do it and we already have Tkachuk and Gaudreau on the LW and I would rather have both those players than Hall.

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18 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

I would say for 11th overall Chuck is dreaming if he thinks he's getting something that good.. not sure what Id give for it , but probably something in the mold of Dube and swap firsts 

 

The mandate for Fletcher was to improve the team now and make them competitive next season, so I can't see him moving it for prospects.

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I am not so sure that the Flames should give up what Philly would want for the 11th overall. While I have limited information on prospects, I don't want them much, but based on what I perceive the Flames needing in the short and long term, most of the players in the 10 - 20 range on TSN (Button) mock draft don't really fit the Flames needs until you get further down the list. Button has Krebs going at 11 who is a C under 6 ft and a -50 with 19 goals. By the sounds of what Philly wants, he needs more work than what I would want to wait on. Kaliyev could be a decent guy to look at if he is still available. Tomasino, Lavoie and York seem like good fits as well. Others on the list are either smaller or possible defensive liabilities. I know these are junior numbers and don't mean much at all for +/- but still.

 

The Flames have enough undersized forwards and longer project middle D, plus young guys currently cracking the roster that I don't think they should jump at a D who may look good now, with a few warts needing time to develop, but we would need to give extra for. Not willing to move (Players with term and value) Dube, Backlund, Monahan, Hanifin, Valimaki, Gaudreau or Lindholm for someone who might help the team in 4 - 5 years. Most of these guys in the 10-30 range will play 2 more years junior and then a couple of years in the AHL, not unlike Dube, before they make the big club. May as well hold onto Dube who will help in the next year or 2. Moving any of these players would need to fix a hole today.

 

With the likes of Seider, Leason, Suzuki and Thomson listed in the mid to late 20's, are any of the players listed in the mid teens that much more likely to be successful and transition well into the NHL? If Dach, Cozens, Byram or Zegras somehow fall to 11, I would seriously consider moving up to grab them, otherwise, might as well wait and grab a similar player without giving up anything. Others may see things differently than me, but from what I have heard, other then the top 3, the rest of the top 10 are basically individual choice and then the rest of the 1st rounders will all be very good possibilities with little separating them.

 

Just my own thoughts. 

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2 minutes ago, bosn111 said:

I am not so sure that the Flames should give up what Philly would want for the 11th overall. While I have limited information on prospects, I don't want them much, but based on what I perceive the Flames needing in the short and long term, most of the players in the 10 - 20 range on TSN (Button) mock draft don't really fit the Flames needs until you get further down the list. Button has Krebs going at 11 who is a C under 6 ft and a -50 with 19 goals. By the sounds of what Philly wants, he needs more work than what I would want to wait on. Kaliyev could be a decent guy to look at if he is still available. Tomasino, Lavoie and York seem like good fits as well. Others on the list are either smaller or possible defensive liabilities. I know these are junior numbers and don't mean much at all for +/- but still.

 

The Flames have enough undersized forwards and longer project middle D, plus young guys currently cracking the roster that I don't think they should jump at a D who may look good now, with a few warts needing time to develop, but we would need to give extra for. Not willing to move (Players with term and value) Dube, Backlund, Monahan, Hanifin, Valimaki, Gaudreau or Lindholm for someone who might help the team in 4 - 5 years. Most of these guys in the 10-30 range will play 2 more years junior and then a couple of years in the AHL, not unlike Dube, before they make the big club. May as well hold onto Dube who will help in the next year or 2. Moving any of these players would need to fix a hole today.

 

With the likes of Seider, Leason, Suzuki and Thomson listed in the mid to late 20's, are any of the players listed in the mid teens that much more likely to be successful and transition well into the NHL? If Dach, Cozens, Byram or Zegras somehow fall to 11, I would seriously consider moving up to grab them, otherwise, might as well wait and grab a similar player without giving up anything. Others may see things differently than me, but from what I have heard, other then the top 3, the rest of the top 10 are basically individual choice and then the rest of the 1st rounders will all be very good possibilities with little separating them.

 

Just my own thoughts. 

 

Krebs is a complete 200 foot player, who is smart, skilled and works hard. His numbers aren't great because he was playing on one of the worst teams in the CHL. Also they were in the process of announcing that they were being moved all season, they are going from Cranbrook to Winnipeg. He was the captain of Canada at the U18 Championships and put up 10 points in 7 games. IMO Krebs would be a great pick.

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JTech, Thanks for the info on him. As I said, I have little viewing or info on specific players. Is he that much better than the others I listed as later on the TSN list and by enough more to have to provide someone like Dube or more? From what I have heard, the answer is not likely.

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37 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

I don't see a fit for Hall. I wouldn't trade Gaudreau for him. They put up similar point totals, but Gaudreau makes the players around him much better, Hall doesn't. Monahan needs a top end playmaking winger to be truly effective, that isn't Hall's game, so Monahan would most likely take a step backwards. Hall is also very prone to injuries.

 

Even if we didn't trade for him and he signed here, we wouldn't have the cap space to do it and we already have Tkachuk and Gaudreau on the LW and I would rather have both those players than Hall.

he missed significant time this year , yes,  but since his rookie season he played less than 50 games only 1 other time . so I wouldn't call him prone.  He apparently could have played much earlier this year too had  they actually still been in the hunt

But there are many factors why I make this trade .

1) Hall is much more suited to a western style playoff .. no denying Johnny's spirit, or drive, but the fact is , outside of 1 series against an equally bad Vancouver squad, Johnny gets shut right down in the playoffs 

2) I say it's more than an educated guess that Johnny is gone when his contract is up . Not because he doesn't like Calgary , but he's a family first kinda guy .. his next contract is his biggest payday wherever he plays and nobody can blame him if he wants to go home --the reverse is true of Hall, he's a western boy , he likely wants out of NJ so he can come back west 

The wasn't much different in the lineups of NBJ this year other than Hall being hurt and they fell right out of the playoff hunt early .. Id say he has an impact  and .. he showed up in the playoffs 

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18 minutes ago, bosn111 said:

JTech, Thanks for the info on him. As I said, I have little viewing or info on specific players. Is he that much better than the others I listed as later on the TSN list and by enough more to have to provide someone like Dube or more? From what I have heard, the answer is not likely.

 

Tomasino, Lavoie and Hoglander are really the only guys I really like at 26 and there is a good chance that they are gone by then.

 

Kaliyev has good skill but the desire and compete is lacking.

 

Leason is a late 2nd rounder IMO

 

Suzuki isn't a guy I would take in the 1st round and I see a big drop off from Krebs to him.

 

Thomson also is a 2nd rounder IMO

 

Seider is tough to get a read on, I have seen him listed in the teens and in the 20's, he has good size and good skating ability, not sure how much offense is there.

 

At the end of the day I think it's a moot point because I don't think we have what Philly wants or we don't want to move what what Philly wants.

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1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

I always take sources with a grain of salt, but if there is any truth to this , I'd be all over it 

 

If we can do the extension first , then Id have no trouble going as high as Johnny.. but if we can get him cheaper as an unsigned player, then it opens up a world of other possibilities

Especially since he seems to have grown up , I have long thought he'd be a perfect fit here

 

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/breaking-taylor-hall-may-be-done-in-new-jersey

Try Neal and Kylington to NJ for Hall and some picks.

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34 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

he missed significant time this year , yes,  but since his rookie season he played less than 50 games only 1 other time . so I wouldn't call him prone.  He apparently could have played much earlier this year too had  they actually still been in the hunt

But there are many factors why I make this trade .

1) Hall is much more suited to a western style playoff .. no denying Johnny's spirit, or drive, but the fact is , outside of 1 series against an equally bad Vancouver squad, Johnny gets shut right down in the playoffs 

2) I say it's more than an educated guess that Johnny is gone when his contract is up . Not because he doesn't like Calgary , but he's a family first kinda guy .. his next contract is his biggest payday wherever he plays and nobody can blame him if he wants to go home --the reverse is true of Hall, he's a western boy , he likely wants out of NJ so he can come back west 

The wasn't much different in the lineups of NBJ this year other than Hall being hurt and they fell right out of the playoff hunt early .. Id say he has an impact  and .. he showed up in the playoffs 

 

I get what you are saying and sure he might be more of a factor in the playoffs and his straight line style of play might be a good fit in the West, but he isn't a guy who makes players around him better.

 

The rest of the team in NJ put up the same totals as the season before, you would expect a dip in production when Hall missed more than half a s season, but that wasn't the case. 

 

Gaudreau creates offense for those around him and makes guys like Monahan and Lindholm better. Hall creates offense for himself.

 

I just think that guys like Monahan and Lindholm end up being 50 point players with Hall as opposed to 80 point players with Gaudreau.

 

At the end of the day I think Gaudreau is way more important to this offense than most like to give him credit for.

 

In the playoffs this year, he tried to make things happen but he was getting next to no help from his linemates.

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3 minutes ago, GM_3300 said:

Try Neal and Kylington and some picks (including our 1st) to NJ for Hall.

 

Fixed it for you.

 

Neal has negative value right now we would probably have to give up Kylington just for a team to take Neal and that's with nothing coming back, let alone adding Hall.

 

To be honest even with our 1st I doubt NJ even considers that deal.

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1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

I always take sources with a grain of salt, but if there is any truth to this , I'd be all over it 

 

If we can do the extension first , then Id have no trouble going as high as Johnny.. but if we can get him cheaper as an unsigned player, then it opens up a world of other possibilities

Especially since he seems to have grown up , I have long thought he'd be a perfect fit here

 

https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/breaking-taylor-hall-may-be-done-in-new-jersey

 

Why do we want another LHS LW?  

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14 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

Fixed it for you.

 

Neal has negative value right now we would probably have to give up Kylington just for a team to take Neal and that's with nothing coming back, let alone adding Hall.

 

To be honest even with our 1st I doubt NJ even considers that deal.

You would be surprise what some GMs will take when there is no going forward with a player.

Let's take a bad contract back like Schneider G and Hall for Neal, Kylington and Gilles. I wouldn't give up a 1st for 1 year of any player. Play Hall at C with Tkachuk he doesn't need anyone to make him better.

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6 minutes ago, GM_3300 said:

You would be surprise what some GMs will take when there is no going forward with a player.

Let's take a bad contract back like Schneider G and Hall for Neal, Kylington and Gilles. I wouldn't give up a 1st for 1 year of any player. Play Hall at C with Tkachuk he doesn't need anyone to make him better.

 

Ottawa got an elite prospect and another mid level prospect and a 2nd round pick for Stone who was an expiring contract.

 

It probably costs north of that for Hall.

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26 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Why do we want another LHS LW?  

because you'd be trading JG for him

 

34 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

I get what you are saying and sure he might be more of a factor in the playoffs and his straight line style of play might be a good fit in the West, but he isn't a guy who makes players around him better.

 

The rest of the team in NJ put up the same totals as the season before, you would expect a dip in production when Hall missed more than half a s season, but that wasn't the case. 

 

Gaudreau creates offense for those around him and makes guys like Monahan and Lindholm better. Hall creates offense for himself.

 

I just think that guys like Monahan and Lindholm end up being 50 point players with Hall as opposed to 80 point players with Gaudreau.

 

At the end of the day I think Gaudreau is way more important to this offense than most like to give him credit for.

 

In the playoffs this year, he tried to make things happen but he was getting next to no help from his linemates.

 

we're not in disagreement over the players.. just maybe views on what''s more effective 

JG is by far the more dynamic player .. when he has room .. but that to me is an issue, in that if hes contained and not allowed to make the players around him better .. suddenly our top line goes MIA

Hall makes himself get room , which I believe would open up more opportunities for the linemates as a result -- he typically does have higher assist totals , so hes feeding the puck to somebody 

 

I would gladly , in a heartbeat take 20 points off every player on the roster , if it meant going a round or 2 deeper in the playoffs 

 

Now, if there was a reasonable way to acquire him AND keep Johnny , Id be all over it .. Johnny and Hall 1-2 down the left side would give teams fits 

 

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20 minutes ago, GM_3300 said:

You would be surprise what some GMs will take when there is no going forward with a player.

Let's take a bad contract back like Schneider G and Hall for Neal, Kylington and Gilles. I wouldn't give up a 1st for 1 year of any player. Play Hall at C with Tkachuk he doesn't need anyone to make him better.

we're talking a player one season removed from the Hart trophy -- they wont be unloading him on the cheap .. more like Dube , Kyllington and a 1st.. they might listen , but not let you talk extension 

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2 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

I would say for 11th overall Chuck is dreaming if he thinks he's getting something that good.. not sure what Id give for it , but probably something in the mold of Dube and swap firsts 

 

 

Bennett?

i don’t want to move him but...

 

he seems the only player to fit the criteria.

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2 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

I would say for 11th overall Chuck is dreaming if he thinks he's getting something that good.. not sure what Id give for it , but probably something in the mold of Dube and swap firsts 

 

How about Brodie + swap first?  

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3 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

 

Bennett?

i don’t want to move him but...

 

he seems the only player to fit the criteria.

possibly except you'd only be trading his rights ..  i got a gut feeling Bennett is gone anyway . Friedman made a good point , hes a prime offer sheet candidate , get him 3+ and we wont match.. so basically you're losing him for a 2nd round pick.. hes a beast in the playoffs , but , you can find those for under 2M

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1 minute ago, The_People1 said:

 

How about Brodie + swap first?  

maybe.. I could see Philly liking him 

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If i'm not mistaken, Johnny was born in NJ and his dad still lives there.  Johnny grew up a Philly fan though and has hinted he'd love to go play there some day.  In other words, as soon as he's UFA, then he's going to Philly (or NJ to be closer to home).  Two teams now looking to make major moves.  NJ and Philly.  Is now the perfect time to sell high on Johnny and literally clean out NJ and Philly's prospect system?  

 

Chuck Fletcher has mentioned something like he'd "love to get 4 players who are 26 that we can sign long term to help us immediately and moving forward."  He's also said Carter Hart "could be a starter in the NHL some day".  He's crazy.  Hart is already a start but he won't give him full support.  He also said he thinks Joel Farabee is penciled in to play a year in the AHL, at least.  Fletcher also said "it's obvious we need help on D."  Fletcher seems to be saying he wants players in their mid-20s and not younger. 

 

Given Philly's mandate to get good NOW, i feel like the Flames can trade Gaudreau + (either Hamonic or Brodie) to Philly for Farabee + Patrick + Hart.

 

I feel we have LW depth to replace Gaudreau by committee.  Farabee + Patrick also project to be first line players in the future.  But the key for me is Carter Hart gives us a goalie of the future.  I think all our G are failed prospects.  Parsons (Injuries), Gillies (injuries+never the same again), Rittich (trending into a solid NHL back-up), Schneider (wildcard still), Zagidulin (unproven), MacDonald (ECHL bust), etc.

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