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2 hours ago, Cowtownguy said:

Too bad Neal came in with an attitude on day 1

 

The Flames gave Neal the best contract of his career, and in return he gave them an attitude of entitlement...   No matter who he plays on a line with, the only ways that he does any better with the oil is if over the summer he reflected on his lack of effort last season and felt embarrassed enough to have some humility...

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12 hours ago, Cowtownguy said:

It appears to me that the Flames organization have been reluctant to acquire players with attitude problems. Too bad Neal came in with an attitude on day 1. I am not sure what his problem was, but he attended Phil Kessel's training camp which consisted of mowing down burgers and dogs.

 

They have and that’s not necessarily a good thing. If the flames were shy on talent I would be all for picking up Ho-Sang because I think he’d be worth the shot. I don’t feel though the flames are short on talent which is why I think the risk is less worth taking. 

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55 minutes ago, redfire11 said:

We missed out on Nichushkin which played a good game against us and he was to have attitude problems.

 

We missed out on a lot by deciding that an exchange of Neal for Lucic was a good cap move.

I liked waht Lucic did in game on, but not for >$5m a year.

 

AT least we don;t have Neal.

He managed to play with McDavid for 1/2 a game.

Kept McD off the scoresheet.

Draisaitl's line played well until Neal went to Nuge's line, then the line of McD/Draisaitl/Kassian scored two.

 

 

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2 hours ago, redfire11 said:

We missed out on Nichushkin which played a good game against us and he was to have attitude problems.

 

I thought the same.  He had a couple good rushes.  Was working hard all game.  For a big guy, had decent speed.

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14 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I thought the same.  He had a couple good rushes.  Was working hard all game.  For a big guy, had decent speed.

 

Like Rieder, he has zero goals last year.

He dropped pretty far in the Stars lineup, but I think a lot of it had to do with the coach over the years.

 

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On 10/4/2019 at 2:53 PM, The_People1 said:

How about Lucic for Ho-Sang?

Actually Lucic hasn't looked bad so far, and there clearly is a discernible uplift throughout the team with him here.  Interesting Lucic comments from Tkachuk on After Hours last night.  He was saying players really fear him, and always know when he is on the ice.  

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40 minutes ago, cccsberg said:

Actually Lucic hasn't looked bad so far, and there clearly is a discernible uplift throughout the team with him here.  Interesting Lucic comments from Tkachuk on After Hours last night.  He was saying players really fear him, and always know when he is on the ice.  

We know Zadorov fears him now. If he didn't have his glove on when he gave him that right, pretty sure Zadorov would have been going to dreamland. lol

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I would see if we could trade Ho Sang for Czarnik.

He's already in the AHL, so keep him there to gauge his play.

Call up someone else in the meantime.

Quine or Gawdin.

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On 10/4/2019 at 7:48 PM, Cowtownguy said:

It appears to me that the Flames organization have been reluctant to acquire players with attitude problems. Too bad Neal came in with an attitude on day 1. I am not sure what his problem was, but he attended Phil Kessel's training camp which consisted of mowing down burgers and dogs.

It isn't that hard to figure out where Neal went off the rails. He thought he was coming here to play with Gaudreau and Monahan but Peters had other ideas and he tuned out.

Unprofessional yes but not totally unexpected behaviour after being told one thing from a GM that wants to sign you and then finding yourself on a 3rd line by a new coach. Either way it's over, let's move on.

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35 minutes ago, GM_3300 said:

It isn't that hard to figure out where Neal went off the rails. He thought he was coming here to play with Gaudreau and Monahan but Peters had other ideas and he tuned out.

Unprofessional yes but not totally unexpected behaviour after being told one thing from a GM that wants to sign you and then finding yourself on a 3rd line by a new coach. Either way it's over, let's move on.

There lies the problem as I see it. Expecting to be gifted the position instead of earning it. If mgmt promised first line duties it was short sighted on their part but if Neal wanted it so bad maybe he could have made more of a case for Peters to consider putting him there.  Oil fans are already shouting he's on pace for 82 goals without considering he's also on pace for -42.  Plus they'll need the extra goals to make up for the extra 82 Smith is gonna let in.

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41 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

There lies the problem as I see it. Expecting to be gifted the position instead of earning it. If mgmt promised first line duties it was short sighted on their part but if Neal wanted it so bad maybe he could have made more of a case for Peters to consider putting him there.  Oil fans are already shouting he's on pace for 82 goals without considering he's also on pace for -42.  Plus they'll need the extra goals to make up for the extra 82 Smith is gonna let in.

This is where fans get it all wrong with professional players especially ones that have been around as long as Neal with already determined accomplishments. Right or wrong he came in with certain expectations however he has also already earned those expectations. If Treliving misrepresented the scenario and created another misfire on a UFA that's on him. All we have as fans is seeing the on ice result of a player with a disgruntled attitude and a lousy result. Treliving went to desperate measures to correct the end mistake so all we can do now is hope Lucic helps us be a better team.

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1 hour ago, GM_3300 said:

It isn't that hard to figure out where Neal went off the rails. He thought he was coming here to play with Gaudreau and Monahan but Peters had other ideas and he tuned out.

Unprofessional yes but not totally unexpected behaviour after being told one thing from a GM that wants to sign you and then finding yourself on a 3rd line by a new coach. Either way it's over, let's move on.

 

8 minutes ago, GM_3300 said:

This is where fans get it all wrong with professional players especially ones that have been around as long as Neal with already determined accomplishments. Right or wrong he came in with certain expectations however he has also already earned those expectations. 

 

Neal had his chances...   He was cycled through a number of line combinations up and down the lineup...   He was also given plenty of opportunity on the PP...

 

None of the opportunities he was given made any difference with his lack of effort, or the results...   He failed to make any meaningful contribution to the team in any capacity...

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12 minutes ago, GM_3300 said:

This is where fans get it all wrong with professional players especially ones that have been around as long as Neal with already determined accomplishments. Right or wrong he came in with certain expectations however he has also already earned those expectations. If Treliving misrepresented the scenario and created another misfire on a UFA that's on him. All we have as fans is seeing the on ice result of a player with a disgruntled attitude and a lousy result. Treliving went to desperate measures to correct the end mistake so all we can do now is hope Lucic helps us be a better team.

I think mgmt may have been blinded by his numbers. As mentioned by another poster in the off season, there had to be a reason the Preds exposed him in the draft and why Vegas didn't really try to keep him. Now he's on his 4th team in 4 years, whether it was the demotion or being disgruntled that shouldnt excuse such a drop in productivity.

 

As for Lucic, he wont make the team any worse than Neal did.

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Here is the thing with James Neal, he signed a big money deal to come to Calgary and instead of working hard to get the season started on the right foot, he showed up out of shape and not ready to play hockey. If you don't show up ready to play hockey at the start of the season then you can't be surprised when you aren't given prime playing time, and quite honestly he was given more minutes than he deserved.

 

The James Neal that played for Calgary last season was the worst hockey player I have ever seen play in the NHL, he brought absolutely zero to this team, his skating was atrocious, he handled the puck like a hand grenade, his shot that has kept him in the league was non-existent. More than anything I am happy to not have him on my team any longer. 

 

He has scored two goals for the Oilers so far, good for him, both of them came with him banging in rebounds in front of the net, a place he never went when he was with Calgary. The fact that he is playing close to 20mins a night in Edmonton says more about how bad Edmonton's team is than anything about Neal's abilities. In Calgary Neal is a 4th liner, because we have at least 12 better forwards than Neal.

 

Edmonton can have him and I could care less what he does there, Neal is my least favorite Flame of all time, just a terrible season from a terrible player. 

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^^^^^

To add to that, I would say the former Oilers have found a role here that suits them.

Don;t need Lucic to be a top 6 player.

Lucic can be out there as a nuclear deterent, and help the team with his ability to protect the puck or forecheck.

Don't need Rieder to score 11 goals.

He's being looked at to kill penalties first, and worry about scoring after that.

 

I sure don;t miss Smith so far.

5 goals against with 3 being almost entirely on him.

7 goals against in two games against non-playoff teams.

Maybe Talbot isn;t much of an answer, but perhaps with a NHL defense in front he may get back his mojo.

 

Do we have any holes in the lineup?

Perhaps we could use a depth LD.

A RHS C might be nice too, or a RHS forward with some size.

 

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1 hour ago, Carty said:

 

 

Neal had his chances...   He was cycled through a number of line combinations up and down the lineup...   He was also given plenty of opportunity on the PP...

 

None of the opportunities he was given made any difference with his lack of effort, or the results...   He failed to make any meaningful contribution to the team in any capacity...

Agreed nothing more to say here. Damage done, damage gone.

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1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

Edmonton can have him and I could care less what he does there, Neal is my least favorite Flame of all time, just a terrible season from a terrible player. 

My sentiments as well, I hope we don't get into comparisons because Neal has scored.  That is a player that got 20 out of Chiasson and 29 out of Maroon, of course he can get Neal, but the bottom line is we don't have a McDavid or a Malkin so he'd be lucky to get 10-15 here, and the rest of his game leaves a lot to be desired.

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2 hours ago, GM_3300 said:

This is where fans get it all wrong with professional players especially ones that have been around as long as Neal with already determined accomplishments. Right or wrong he came in with certain expectations however he has also already earned those expectations. If Treliving misrepresented the scenario and created another misfire on a UFA that's on him. All we have as fans is seeing the on ice result of a player with a disgruntled attitude and a lousy result. Treliving went to desperate measures to correct the end mistake so all we can do now is hope Lucic helps us be a better team.

That bolded statement, if true is where he failed. If any pro athlete comes in to camp unprepared they deserve their fate. Also I know many pro athletes none of them take any of thing for granted, the league has changed to fast. One day your a star the next you can`t find a roster in the AHL. If anyone miss read this situation was BT, as GM  you could assume that any athlete with any form of competitiveness and compete would have pushed themselves to be ready for the opportunity, Neal clearly didn't.  If anything Neal had his eyes opened that he isn't that Blockchaining talented without preparation. Will he score more goals with Dry saddle and MC Jesus, Blockchain who couldn`t, plus he put the work in this year, it will most likely pay off. Ss if we use your analogy of accomplishments from last year, heis bottom 6 on this club, over paid with no contributing factor. Lucis same pay is more effective in that role. In the 2 games I have seen Lucic has been more of a factor than Neal was all of last year. 

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2 hours ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

I think mgmt may have been blinded by his numbers. As mentioned by another poster in the off season, there had to be a reason the Preds exposed him in the draft and why Vegas didn't really try to keep him. Now he's on his 4th team in 4 years, whether it was the demotion or being disgruntled that shouldnt excuse such a drop in productivity.

 

As for Lucic, he wont make the team any worse than Neal did.

 

 

I think rhat Lucic not making the team any better or worse is the problem. Him not making it better and actually keeps the Flames depth bad. 

 

The problem last year was that the 3rd line couldn’t do anything. It is trending that way again with players only getting or averaging around 10 minutes. 

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I feel like the way that Peters runs his lines makes the Flames a one line team. 

 

Tkachuk isnt good enough to run the 2nd line on his own and Backs could be slightly injured. 

 

Again, the rest of the team seems to be a mishmash of a bunch of players that don’t fully compliment each other. 

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27 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

I feel like the way that Peters runs his lines makes the Flames a one line team. 

 

Tkachuk isnt good enough to run the 2nd line on his own and Backs could be slightly injured. 

 

Again, the rest of the team seems to be a mishmash of a bunch of players that don’t fully compliment each other. 

 

I'm not sure I get where you are coming from.

This is essentially the same team that scored a ton last year, with 5 players over 70 points.

We had scoring up and down the lineup.

Subtracting Neal and Hathaway doesn't turn us into the 2018/19 Oilers.

 

The bigger concern should be special teams.

We try to make a statement and get called for anything resembling grit.

The PK looked better against VAN but still too many chances.

The PP is a work in progress.

Backlund, Ryan, and Brodie did not give us much last year with Neal and a 2nd D.

Inserting Lucic and Ras in there isn;t going to help this year.

 

 

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6 hours ago, GM_3300 said:

It isn't that hard to figure out where Neal went off the rails. He thought he was coming here to play with Gaudreau and Monahan but Peters had other ideas and he tuned out.

Unprofessional yes but not totally unexpected behaviour after being told one thing from a GM that wants to sign you and then finding yourself on a 3rd line by a new coach. Either way it's over, let's move on.

Exactly the case.  His attitude forced a trade because he was not professional and poison in the room, I'd expect.  

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1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

I'm not sure I get where you are coming from.

This is essentially the same team that scored a ton last year, with 5 players over 70 points.

We had scoring up and down the lineup.

Subtracting Neal and Hathaway doesn't turn us into the 2018/19 Oilers.

 

The bigger concern should be special teams.

We try to make a statement and get called for anything resembling grit.

The PK looked better against VAN but still too many chances.

The PP is a work in progress.

Backlund, Ryan, and Brodie did not give us much last year with Neal and a 2nd D.

Inserting Lucic and Ras in there isn;t going to help this year.

 

 

 

 

Gio, Gaudreau, Monahan, Lindholm, Tkachuk (PP1). All one line. You stop them and you stop the Flames. It’s only two games but it’s trending that way again. That’s what I am getting at. The coach is doing almost exactly what didn’t work at the end of the year.

 

I get it, Tkachuk is on line two but he got a lot from PP1, and extra attacker minutes.

 

i think they’re great players, but 

the first line plus Tkachuk will get its looks and points until later (ASB) when it gets tough again. It has happened two years in a row. 

 

I want more and think BP can get more out of this group if he mixed it up better. He’s not really coaching past keeping the lines the same. He’s running with guys who are skating and then what? 

 

Mix it up so there is another line that is a real threat.

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