Jump to content
The Official Site of the Calgary Flames
Jessemadnote39

Realistic Trade suggestions for improvement

Recommended Posts

8 hours ago, sak22 said:

Two of these aren't related.  One was accusations and one was actual proof.  Peters wasn't immediately fired but was removed from the team, to investigate behavior from the past, Leipsic made recent comments including insults towards teammates.  I don't believe they take a different approach.  I don't believe showing loyalty to players is non-sense, players talk, agents act differently for different GM's or owners, and sometimes moving the wrong player at the wrong time changes an entire dressing room.  Guys like Warrener and Regehr have mentioned on the Fan how the Andrew Ference trade was demoralizing because message the players took was that they couldn't win with that group, should that trade have made them better?  Yes, but they barely made the playoffs and were a disaster in it.  Right now what does trading Giordano do to the room.

 

7 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Right now, we will barely make the playoffs and if it wasn't for a weak Pacific Division, we would be a disaster in it.  If we were as good as last season then ya, point taken.  Giordano is da man!  However, we just squeezing into the playoffs.  Maybe Giordano's decline is directly related to our results this season... And the problem is, he's getting even older.

 

It's hard to argue we are dismantling a Cup contender before it had a chance if we traded Giordano (pending return).

 

 

Peeps, I know we all have argued about the Flames last season, and know that I just don't think they were that good last year. They have the talent to be that good, but they also got away with a lot of poorly played games due to the first line for half a season, and then the 4th line for the rest, which was a disaster for a playoffs waiting to happen. But I think if they actually tried every game, they could be that team. But they've proven that they're not.

 

Sak22, One thing that Gio leaving can do is change up the leadership of the team. But the thing we gotta ask, are there any other players able to take on that role? Are they mature enough to do it? 

 

I am not advocating for moving Giordano, but just adding to the possibilities for conversation sake. But for me, I realize that anyone is moveable in any league. Plus, I am too old to be as sentimental towards players anymore. I can have favourites, but I don't follow them around the league like I did when I was a teenager or in my twenties. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Right now, we will barely make the playoffs and if it wasn't for a weak Pacific Division, we would be a disaster in it.  If we were as good as last season then ya, point taken.  Giordano is da man!  However, we just squeezing into the playoffs.  Maybe Giordano's decline is directly related to our results this season... And the problem is, he's getting even older.

 

It's hard to argue we are dismantling a Cup contender before it had a chance if we traded Giordano (pending return).

 

The other thing is, how many playoff games has Giordano played in and how many has he helped lead the team to victory in? How did he do in the playoffs last year? He didn't up his game at all. 

 

 

2 hours ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

The better return would be from a Hanifin deal. Maybe package him with someone for a 2nd-3rd line RW.

 

 

Then I say move Hanifin! He's young; could he be a late bloomer? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

Sak22, One thing that Gio leaving can do is change up the leadership of the team. But the thing we gotta ask, are there any other players able to take on that role? Are they mature enough to do it? 

 

I am not advocating for moving Giordano, but just adding to the possibilities for conversation sake. But for me, I realize that anyone is moveable in any league. Plus, I am too old to be as sentimental towards players anymore. I can have favourites, but I don't follow them around the league like I did when I was a teenager or in my twenties. 

For me its not about sentiment, its about the message of the white towel being thrown.  I hate quitters, and putting a focus on 3 years instead of next year is doing that and IMO players will be turned off from that.  We talk about Gaudreau leaving like its a foregone conclusion, I think Tkachuk won't be too far behind.  Winning culture is brought up so much, downgrading a position when you are closer than you think isn't how we build it.

 

 

10 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

The other thing is, how many playoff games has Giordano played in and how many has he helped lead the team to victory in? How did he do in the playoffs last year? He didn't up his game at all. 

 

Does the past indicate the future?  Remember when Jay Bouwmeester was not a guy you win with, Ovechkin was never going to win the cup, Pittsburgh after every failure from 2010-2015 needed to trade Malkin to win another, Datsyuk was pretty dreadful his first few playoffs once he became an offensive leader, Yzerman, Lemieux, the list goes on and on.  The past is almost always irrelevant in sports.  People here love rebuilding, but truly have no patience for a St. Louis or Washington type struggle, if you don't win in 5 years like Pittsburgh and Chicago its a failure and needs to start over.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, sak22 said:

For me its not about sentiment, its about the message of the white towel being thrown.  I hate quitters, and putting a focus on 3 years instead of next year is doing that and IMO players will be turned off from that.  We talk about Gaudreau leaving like its a foregone conclusion, I think Tkachuk won't be too far behind.  Winning culture is brought up so much, downgrading a position when you are closer than you think isn't how we build it.

 

 

Does the past indicate the future?  Remember when Jay Bouwmeester was not a guy you win with, Ovechkin was never going to win the cup, Pittsburgh after every failure from 2010-2015 needed to trade Malkin to win another, Datsyuk was pretty dreadful his first few playoffs once he became an offensive leader, Yzerman, Lemieux, the list goes on and on.  The past is almost always irrelevant in sports.  People here love rebuilding, but truly have no patience for a St. Louis or Washington type struggle, if you don't win in 5 years like Pittsburgh and Chicago its a failure and needs to start over.

 

 

That is true. I hope that last year's playoff experience has helped him to push forward. 

I actually think this time the break could be good for them. It's kind of go time once the season gets back into the swing of things. This team feels like procrastinators, which I think is their biggest problem. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, sak22 said:

For me its not about sentiment, its about the message of the white towel being thrown.  I hate quitters, and putting a focus on 3 years instead of next year is doing that and IMO players will be turned off from that.  We talk about Gaudreau leaving like its a foregone conclusion, I think Tkachuk won't be too far behind.  Winning culture is brought up so much, downgrading a position when you are closer than you think isn't how we build it.

 

Did someone propose we tank for a higher pick or trade Giordano for the sake of it without considering if the return is good value?  Please explain.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, robrob74 said:

That is true. I hope that last year's playoff experience has helped him to push forward. 

I actually think this time the break could be good for them. It's kind of go time once the season gets back into the swing of things. This team feels like procrastinators, which I think is their biggest problem. 

 

Should we target a player who brings more playoff experience than Giordano?  Maybe it will help us in the playoffs?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

Did someone propose we tank for a higher pick or trade Giordano for the sake of it without considering if the return is good value?  Please explain.

 

 

Should we target a player who brings more playoff experience than Giordano?  Maybe it will help us in the playoffs?

 

I am not really sure. I would like someone with leadership qualities, but that also backfired the last few times. Brouwer, Lucic, and anyone else with playoff experience that we got recently? 

 

When articles come out like a redraft of the 2018 NHL Entry Draft, then I get so pissed at the fact the Flames didn't have a pick in the first few rounds. Like WTF! The Islanders got both picks for Hamonic. For me, almost getting some picks would be fine, as we seem to use them to trade for players anyway. Although, BT has done a good job of identifying needs, but not always a good job of filling them. Goaltending and D has been satisfactory, yet so many picks went for both of them. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, robrob74 said:

 

I am not really sure. I would like someone with leadership qualities, but that also backfired the last few times. Brouwer, Neal, and anyone else with playoff experience that we got recently? 

 

When articles come out like a redraft of the 2018 NHL Entry Draft, then I get so pissed at the fact the Flames didn't have a pick in the first few rounds. Like WTF! The Islanders got both picks for Hamonic. For me, almost getting some picks would be fine, as we seem to use them to trade for players anyway. Although, BT has done a good job of identifying needs, but not always a good job of filling them. Goaltending and D has been satisfactory, yet so many picks went for both of them. 

 

Fixed.  Can't put Lucic in that category until he fails in the playoffs.  Lucic from what I can gather is loved in the room, Brouwer I've heard wasn't a good match and Neal (well there is this https://streamable.com/0ybzwx).

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Recently the Flames have started doing almost daily calls with season ticket holders and a mix of both players and management. I've been on a few now and one of the consistent themes that is coming up on all of them, Lucic is extremely loved in the organization. Players love him and say he has brought a tremendous attitude to the team, has fit in like a glove, and is one of the more vocal guys they have. Not in a "hey let's get it done" type of way but when he speaks people listen. I agree that it hasn't been easy for the Flames to augment their core with a veteran presence but it does sounds like they've got a match with Lucic finally. 

 

In a perfect world, and with a bit of a younger team, you ideally want not just a veteran presence but a veteran presence that can pick you up on the ice too. That's not really Lucic unfortunately, although he has his moments, so pairing the two would be ideally. Extremely tough to do though so I understand why it hasn't happened. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, cross16 said:

Recently the Flames have started doing almost daily calls with season ticket holders and a mix of both players and management. I've been on a few now and one of the consistent themes that is coming up on all of them, Lucic is extremely loved in the organization. Players love him and say he has brought a tremendous attitude to the team, has fit in like a glove, and is one of the more vocal guys they have. Not in a "hey let's get it done" type of way but when he speaks people listen. I agree that it hasn't been easy for the Flames to augment their core with a veteran presence but it does sounds like they've got a match with Lucic finally. 

 

In a perfect world, and with a bit of a younger team, you ideally want not just a veteran presence but a veteran presence that can pick you up on the ice too. That's not really Lucic unfortunately, although he has his moments, so pairing the two would be ideally. Extremely tough to do though so I understand why it hasn't happened. 

 

 

It's too bad that Jagr wanted to keep playing hockey and wouldn't have wanted to stay in the organization. I feel like he was really good for Gaudreau. He helped him take that next step, but then took a step back this year. I think just the words that were shared between them, helped Johnny believe he was that 99pts player. Jagr has the resume/experience to legitimize what Johnny could do. 

 

It sounds like Lucic is good for the team. I wish he could be a bit cheaper, but when you take away the cost of having him, this year he was a good player for what he does. You'd ideally want him at 1M or 2.5 or something if you're paying for the leadership. But his try-hard attitude is consistent. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, cross16 said:

Recently the Flames have started doing almost daily calls with season ticket holders and a mix of both players and management. I've been on a few now and one of the consistent themes that is coming up on all of them, Lucic is extremely loved in the organization. Players love him and say he has brought a tremendous attitude to the team, has fit in like a glove, and is one of the more vocal guys they have. Not in a "hey let's get it done" type of way but when he speaks people listen. I agree that it hasn't been easy for the Flames to augment their core with a veteran presence but it does sounds like they've got a match with Lucic finally. 

 

In a perfect world, and with a bit of a younger team, you ideally want not just a veteran presence but a veteran presence that can pick you up on the ice too. That's not really Lucic unfortunately, although he has his moments, so pairing the two would be ideally. Extremely tough to do though so I understand why it hasn't happened. 

 

I think Lucic has another gear he can get to.

You saw it at times, but it wasn't every game.

Watching him play in the playoffs in EDM, there was a lot of what he does not, just a bit off.

I think he can get there.

 

This year was an enigma, IMHO.  He went from being down-trodden in EDM to poorly coached in CGY.

I do think he would be better off with a slightly different set of linemates.

I think Bennett is the worst one to play with.

Even if he has showed well on a line with Bennett, the mix of player skills is just wrong.

 

I'm not exactly sure what would work, but Dube is key.

Ryan hasn't been that much of a positive impact.

He's just not quite right.

 

I think speed and some measure of grit is what he needs with him.

Dube can take a hit, so that's fine.

Just not sure of the 3rd.

I doubt Janko does it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been seeing from some Leaf fans that they think the best way to clear some cap space would be to move Freddie Andersen..... 

 

I sure hope so, IMO Freddie is the best player on the Leafs, I'd be all over that if I was BT... and we do know he tried when Freddie was a Duck.

 

Andersen is a proven workhorse. This last season was a "bad" season by his standards, which has ultimately been very close to Rittich's best season.

 

Maybe BT can get TOR to take Rittich, he makes almost half of what Andersen makes. Rittich and Campbell could give them quality goaltending for about the same as what Andersen makes.

 

CGY gets their first true starter since Kipper and one that can play more than 50 games without breaking down due to injury or his play falling off.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At soon to be 31 and 1 year away from being a UFA I would be a pass on Andersen personally. I'm not that big a fan, although acknowledge he is certainly above avg as a starter, but I just don't think his age/contract status make him a good fit for the Flames right now. Between that and a potentially high acquisition cost I don't see the upside for the Flames. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/14/2020 at 9:05 PM, Thebrewcrew said:

I've been seeing from some Leaf fans that they think the best way to clear some cap space would be to move Freddie Andersen..... 

 

I sure hope so, IMO Freddie is the best player on the Leafs, I'd be all over that if I was BT... and we do know he tried when Freddie was a Duck.

 

Andersen is a proven workhorse. This last season was a "bad" season by his standards, which has ultimately been very close to Rittich's best season.

 

Maybe BT can get TOR to take Rittich, he makes almost half of what Andersen makes. Rittich and Campbell could give them quality goaltending for about the same as what Andersen makes.

 

CGY gets their first true starter since Kipper and one that can play more than 50 games without breaking down due to injury or his play falling off.

 

 

There is also talk of trading for LTIR players.

It's a cheap way to gain cap..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/14/2020 at 9:05 PM, Thebrewcrew said:

I've been seeing from some Leaf fans that they think the best way to clear some cap space would be to move Freddie Andersen..... 

 

I sure hope so, IMO Freddie is the best player on the Leafs, I'd be all over that if I was BT... and we do know he tried when Freddie was a Duck.

 

Andersen is a proven workhorse. This last season was a "bad" season by his standards, which has ultimately been very close to Rittich's best season.

 

Maybe BT can get TOR to take Rittich, he makes almost half of what Andersen makes. Rittich and Campbell could give them quality goaltending for about the same as what Andersen makes.

 

CGY gets their first true starter since Kipper and one that can play more than 50 games without breaking down due to injury or his play falling off.

 

 

I like Andersen but i see him as a minor upgrade over Rittich at twice the cap hit.  The price/reward just doesn't make sense.  Andersen is not a top 5 in the NHL or anything special like that.  I would keep Rittich and save the cap ourselves.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Someone that could be worth looking into this offseason is Sam Reinhart. He could have similar upside to Lindholm.

 

He has also made some comments about the culture and the team in Buffalo the past couple of years, probably hoping to receive the ROR treatment and get shipped out of there

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
57 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Someone that could be worth looking into this offseason is Sam Reinhart. He could have similar upside to Lindholm.

 

He has also made some comments about the culture and the team in Buffalo the past couple of years, probably hoping to receive the ROR treatment and get shipped out of there

 

Ya Reinhart got into it with a reporter in BUF for not backchecking hard on a play and they lost that game.  It really does sound like that BUF roster hates playing in Buffalo.  Fans and reporters have become impatient and hostile.

 

I would welcome Reinhart.  He can play C/RW and he's RHS.  But I really hope we can get Eichel for Gaudreau+...

 

...and home town boy LW Taylor Hall is a UFA if we want to go that route to replace Gaudreau.  Also, Tkachuk is our new #1 LW, Etc etc...all talked about already. 

 

With a good off-season, we can really setup to be a contender.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

Ya Reinhart got into it with a reporter in BUF for not backchecking hard on a play and they lost that game.  It really does sound like that BUF roster hates playing in Buffalo.  Fans and reporters have become impatient and hostile.

 

I would welcome Reinhart.  He can play C/RW and he's RHS.  But I really hope we can get Eichel for Gaudreau+...

 

...and home town boy LW Taylor Hall is a UFA if we want to go that route to replace Gaudreau.  Also, Tkachuk is our new #1 LW, Etc etc...all talked about already. 

 

With a good off-season, we can really setup to be a contender.


 

if Reinhart has any stick-handling ability he doesn’t need major speed. Look at Gaudreau and Monahan with Hudler. Hudler was awesome as a Flames player.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, robrob74 said:


 

if Reinhart has any stick-handling ability he doesn’t need major speed. Look at Gaudreau and Monahan with Hudler. Hudler was awesome as a Flames player.

 

What would it take to trade for Reinhart?

 

Also, Reinhart is RFA this summer.  He's a 50 to 65-point player... add in his age, potential, draft position, etc, will Reinhart cost $6-mil-per?  Even if Buffalo and Reinhart wants to part ways, is this going to be a cheap acquisition?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

What would it take to trade for Reinhart?

 

Also, Reinhart is RFA this summer.  He's a 50 to 65-point player... add in his age, potential, draft position, etc, will Reinhart cost $6-mil-per?  Even if Buffalo and Reinhart wants to part ways, is this going to be a cheap acquisition?  

Probably would cost Hanifin. 

 

Unless of course his negotiations don't go smooth. I can't imagine he wants to be a Sabre for another 6 years. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Probably would cost Hanifin. 

 

Unless of course his negotiations don't go smooth. I can't imagine he wants to be a Sabre for another 6 years. 

 

If Hanifin gets it done, then it's an obvious move we should make.  It's trading from a position of strength (LD) for a position of weakness (RW/C).  Hopefully the cap hit becomes a wash as well.  It would still leave us on LD with Giordano, Valimaki, Kylington, Gustafsson, Forbort, and Brodie.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another trade option could be Christian Fischer. He had a huge fall off this year like Jankowski. Perhaps that could be a straight up change of scene move.

 

Yotes are gonna lose Soderberg to UFA and possibly have to trade Stepan, they may have a need for Janko. Tocchet would also love his penalty killing.

 

Fischer brings a big body that can impact a game physically if it's not happening for him on the scoresheet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

What would it take to trade for Reinhart?

 

Also, Reinhart is RFA this summer.  He's a 50 to 65-point player... add in his age, potential, draft position, etc, will Reinhart cost $6-mil-per?  Even if Buffalo and Reinhart wants to part ways, is this going to be a cheap acquisition?  

 

14 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Probably would cost Hanifin. 

 

Unless of course his negotiations don't go smooth. I can't imagine he wants to be a Sabre for another 6 years. 


 

my thinking is it would take more than Hanifin, but maybe Hanifin and Bennett or Jankowski?  And possibly a 2nd or 3rd rounder? Am I overrating Reinhart? Maybe no pick...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
43 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

my thinking is it would take more than Hanifin, but maybe Hanifin and Bennett or Jankowski?  And possibly a 2nd or 3rd rounder? Am I overrating Reinhart? Maybe no pick...

 

I'm not sure what the league thinks of Hanifin anymore but he's signed long term and BUF would like that.  BUF has lots of RD but no LD like Hanifin.  It could work well for both teams.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...