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In case anyone was holding out hope of buying out Lucic without the cap implications.

 

 

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24 minutes ago, cross16 said:

In case anyone was holding out hope of buying out Lucic 

 

 

 

Wouldn't mind doing to Lucic what we did to Stone.  Buy him out and then sign him back at basically league minimum.  Lucic is a good 4th liner and great leadership guy.

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4 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Wouldn't mind doing to Lucic what we did to Stone.  Buy him out and then sign him back at basically league minimum.  Lucic is a good 4th liner and great leadership guy.

 

That is not an option for the Flames with Lucic because his contract is bonus heavy so they cap savings is minimal. You would actually lose cap space by doing so because it would cost you more to sign Lucic then you'd save via the buyout. 

 

The only reason to buyout Lucic is you want him off the team or you want the spot for someone else. The expansion draft could be another reason but i don't suspect it will come to that. 

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I have no issues with Lucic. He's overpaid, but he did what he was brought in to do. He's been a much better Flame than Neal.

 

My only issue was his usage. At this stage of his career he doesn't need to be on the PP, IMO. That speaks to a lack of bottom 6 depth though.

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2 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I have no issues with Lucic. He's overpaid, but he did what he was brought in to do. He's been a much better Flame than Neal.

 

My only issue was his usage. At this stage of his career he doesn't need to be on the PP, IMO. That speaks to a lack of bottom 6 depth though.

 

I think his usage has a couple of problems.  He plays on a weak PP unit.  What would it look like to have him in front of the net on the top unit?

He played a lot with Ryan and Dube.  I was not a big fan of that.  If Lucic's strong points are possession and board work, someone capable of sustaining O-zone play has to be part of his line.  

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One guy who I think the Flames should look at in free agency, is Tyson Barrie. He is a RHS D who can effectively QB a PP. Two things this team could use on the backend.

 

Similar to Gardiner last off season I don't think he is going to get as much as he thought. I think he will get around $4m-$4.5m.

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41 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

One guy who I think the Flames should look at in free agency, is Tyson Barrie. He is a RHS D who can effectively QB a PP. Two things this team could use on the backend.

 

Similar to Gardiner last off season I don't think he is going to get as much as he thought. I think he will get around $4m-$4.5m.

 

How much do you think it will cost to bring back Brodie instead?

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Who would Barrie play with? His best fit is probably Gio, but is Barrie able to handle those minutes against the oppositions best? Hanifin wouldn’t be a great fit with Barrie. If you’re playing him on the 3rd pair, I would just sign Gustafsson

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46 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Who would Barrie play with? His best fit is probably Gio, but is Barrie able to handle those minutes against the oppositions best? Hanifin wouldn’t be a great fit with Barrie. If you’re playing him on the 3rd pair, I would just sign Gustafsson

 

Agreed.  Between Giordano, Andersson, Hanifin, and Kylington we have enough speed/mobility.  Like you said, we can even bring back Gustafson even.

 

I also think we need to get more mean on the blueline instead of adding more offensive minded D.  Someone like Derek Engellend.  I know BT misses Engellend and that role he played.  Bottom pair RHS RD.  Hits.  Fights.  Leader.  And serviceable in a 2nd unit PK role. 

 

Is there a 25-year-old Engellend available out there?

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I like Barrie as a player but I also agree the fit isn't there unless they really plan to overhaul things and deal Hanifin or something.Barrie is at his best with heavy o zone starts and being put in favorable situations. I could see that working with Hanifin, but the idea of playing Hanifin and Barrie together would give me nightmares as soon as the puck entered the defensive zone. I could see Valimaki-Barrie working if there was a plan to move Hanifin but i really don't like Gio-Barrie as an option and I don't think Gio would either. Gio struggled with Hamilton (not in terms of results) and I see a similar game in Barrie.

 

The skill set fits though as i think the Flames could stand to get more mobile and a better first pass from their d core to help their transition game but at the same time I don't disagree they could stand to get more physical as well. That's why, even though it sucks to say this, i think they will bring back Hamonic. I don't think they are prepared to lose that skill set and it's not one they can replace in UFA that i'm seeing. Could look at the trade market but for what target and what price? Prime aged, RS dmen are not exactly cheap nor are the Flames overflowing with assets. 

 

One player i've been wondering about is Josh Manson. There were some rumors around the deadline the Ducks were listening on him and there are also long standing rumors they like Bennett. While Manson's offensive impact is minimal he checks just about every box they could want in a more defensive oriented top 4 dman and he certainty packs a punch. Not a perfect fit but like I said a "perfect" fit is going to likely be cost prohibitive.

 

I think the price on Manson would be high but if there is a possibility that Bennett could be the center piece it might actually make it doable  

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35 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I like Barrie as a player but I also agree the fit isn't there unless they really plan to overhaul things and deal Hanifin or something.Barrie is at his best with heavy o zone starts and being put in favorable situations. I could see that working with Hanifin, but the idea of playing Hanifin and Barrie together would give me nightmares as soon as the puck entered the defensive zone. I could see Valimaki-Barrie working if there was a plan to move Hanifin but i really don't like Gio-Barrie as an option and I don't think Gio would either. Gio struggled with Hamilton (not in terms of results) and I see a similar game in Barrie.

 

The skill set fits though as i think the Flames could stand to get more mobile and a better first pass from their d core to help their transition game but at the same time I don't disagree they could stand to get more physical as well. That's why, even though it sucks to say this, i think they will bring back Hamonic. I don't think they are prepared to lose that skill set and it's not one they can replace in UFA that i'm seeing. Could look at the trade market but for what target and what price? Prime aged, RS dmen are not exactly cheap nor are the Flames overflowing with assets. 

 

One player i've been wondering about is Josh Manson. There were some rumors around the deadline the Ducks were listening on him and there are also long standing rumors they like Bennett. While Manson's offensive impact is minimal he checks just about every box they could want in a more defensive oriented top 4 dman and he certainty packs a punch. Not a perfect fit but like I said a "perfect" fit is going to likely be cost prohibitive.

 

I think the price on Manson would be high but if there is a possibility that Bennett could be the center piece it might actually make it doable  

 

Manson did have a good year the last time the Ducks made the playoffs.

He would be preferable to Hamonic for sure.

Bennett would be a good fit there as well.

The Ducks have some cap issues next year, so we might have to take Backes to make it work for them.

 

Anaheim has so many needs that perhaps they would take a flyer on Janko.

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30 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I can't comment on the source, but an article suggesting the Rangers are expected to make bids on Gaudreau this off-season. 

 

Trade suggestion is Alexander Georgiev, DeAngelo and perhaps pick/picks. 

 

https://www.nhltraderumors.me/2020/07/rumor-ny-rangers-to-make-trade-offer.html

 

Could we get Kaapo Kakko with Gaudreau?  We will have to add but Kakko is going to be elite one day.  It's weird Gaudreau would be a target considering Rangers just extended LW Panarin and LW Kreider long term.  The Rangers have proven to have no patience for kids so maybe Kakko for Gaudreau+ gets it done.

 

Georgiev is only a slight upgrade over Rittich... Although we could add him as a new tandem.  I like Georgiev... But losing Gaudreau for him isn't enough.

 

DeAngelo... Don't like him.  It sucks to see Adam Fox is going to be a good one... Basically playing his way to #2 on the depth chart after Trouba.  Maybe even be the Rangers best Damn soon.  DeAngelo has good potential but sounds like a locker room problem.

 

Only other asset worth considering is the Rangers #13 overall pick.  Depends who is still on the board but that's something I wouldn't mind.

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21 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Manson did have a good year the last time the Ducks made the playoffs.

He would be preferable to Hamonic for sure.

Bennett would be a good fit there as well.

The Ducks have some cap issues next year, so we might have to take Backes to make it work for them.

 

Anaheim has so many needs that perhaps they would take a flyer on Janko.

I don't know why we'd need to take Backes.  If you go with Bennett and either pick or prospect, for Manson that provides them 1.5M cap relief.  We take in Backes as well and we got 8.6M coming in and 2.5M going out doesn't leave much to do other things, I'm also ruling out Janko as a flyer Anaheim really has no use for him.

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7 minutes ago, sak22 said:

I don't know why we'd need to take Backes.  If you go with Bennett and either pick or prospect, for Manson that provides them 1.5M cap relief.  We take in Backes as well and we got 8.6M coming in and 2.5M going out doesn't leave much to do other things, I'm also ruling out Janko as a flyer Anaheim really has no use for him.

 

The extra cap relief for taking Backes is to offset the asking price for Manson.

Essentially, this would replace Brodie's contract, so it's really just the difference between Bennett's salary and Backes.

We don't really have a lot of picks available this year.  1st, 2nd and SJS's 4th.  Next year 1,2,3 but no 4th.

It would need to be prospects.

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1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

Manson did have a good year the last time the Ducks made the playoffs.

He would be preferable to Hamonic for sure.

Bennett would be a good fit there as well.

The Ducks have some cap issues next year, so we might have to take Backes to make it work for them.

 

Anaheim has so many needs that perhaps they would take a flyer on Janko.


is Backes an LTR candidate? 
I think If that were the case he’d go to the Leafs. They’re going to need to trade for more as the LTR contracts they have this season expire. 

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That Ranger article completely lost me at the Flames "are in desperate need to make a hockey trade". Ummm, they'd like to make one, but don't need to. Also don't agree with being thin in net, Rittich had a better year than Georgiev. Deangelo is a younger Barrie.

 

For NYR it makes little sense for them to move Georgiev. Shesterkin is expansion exempt, so they can keep Georgiev and run the same tandem. Buy Lundqvist out, or maybe he flat out retires like Luongo did. 

 

 

 

Regarding the blueline, I'd try to keep Brodie, my ideal offer is 4.7-5 on a 4 or 5 year term. I realistically could see them keeping Hamonic though, RHS and they love his intangibles. I'd say 4x4 as my max offer, but ideally a 3 year term.

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3 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

The extra cap relief for taking Backes is to offset the asking price for Manson.

Essentially, this would replace Brodie's contract, so it's really just the difference between Bennett's salary and Backes.

We don't really have a lot of picks available this year.  1st, 2nd and SJS's 4th.  Next year 1,2,3 but no 4th.

It would need to be prospects.


 

we really like to trade a lot of picks! Gross

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3 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

That Ranger article completely lost me at the Flames "are in desperate need to make a hockey trade". Ummm, they'd like to make one, but don't need to. Also don't agree with being thin in net, Rittich had a better year than Georgiev. Deangelo is a younger Barrie.

 

For NYR it makes little sense for them to move Georgiev. Shesterkin is expansion exempt, so they can keep Georgiev and run the same tandem. Buy Lundqvist out, or maybe he flat out retires like Luongo did. 

 

 

 

Regarding the blueline, I'd try to keep Brodie, my ideal offer is 4.7-5 on a 4 or 5 year term. I realistically could see them keeping Hamonic though, RHS and they love his intangibles. I'd say 4x4 as my max offer, but ideally a 3 year term.


I would try 4.5 on Brodie. I think D don’t get paid as high yet. When the UFA D signed the past few years the talk was why haven’t the D contracts risen with the F’s? 
 

he is better than Gardiner but how much better? 
 

for Hamonic I would go 3.5x4. He’s boatdering on 3rd pair now so it’s dangerous to pay him high bucks. 

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2 minutes ago, robrob74 said:


I would try 4.5 on Brodie. I think D don’t get paid as high yet. When the UFA D signed the past few years the talk was why haven’t the D contracts risen with the F’s? 
 

he is better than Gardiner but how much better? 
 

for Hamonic I would go 3.5x4. He’s boatdering on 3rd pair now so it’s dangerous to pay him high bucks. 

I just don't see them taking pay-cuts and as pending UFA's the Flames have very little leverage.

 

Brodie was probably the Flames best D this season. Kinda hard to ask your best D from this season to take less.

 

Hamonic doesn't deserve more, but as a coveted RHD, he will get a raise from his 3.8. If it's not from the Flames, WPG, TOR etc will give it to him

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14 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I just don't see them taking pay-cuts and as pending UFA's the Flames have very little leverage.

 

Brodie was probably the Flames best D this season. Kinda hard to ask your best D from this season to take less.

 

Hamonic doesn't deserve more, but as a coveted RHD, he will get a raise from his 3.8. If it's not from the Flames, WPG, TOR etc will give it to him


 

I don’t see Hamonic worth his previous contract. I think he’ll have to take a cut and he will realize it in UFA. If someone wants to pay him then that’s fine. I see him closer to the Stone I think BT thought he was signing than him getting a pay raise. But I’d he gets it, let him walk. I wish they tried to deal him for anything at the deadline. 
 

so with Brodie I think he could get a slight raise. I’d try sign him to the same deal. He was bad for a part of the season. But after his seizure on the ice he played a really good game and was the best from then on. 
I just don’t see him as a 6m guy, maybe 5-5.5.

 

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1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

Could we get Kaapo Kakko with Gaudreau?  We will have to add but Kakko is going to be elite one day.  It's weird Gaudreau would be a target considering Rangers just extended LW Panarin and LW Kreider long term.  The Rangers have proven to have no patience for kids so maybe Kakko for Gaudreau+ gets it done.

 

Georgiev is only a slight upgrade over Rittich... Although we could add him as a new tandem.  I like Georgiev... But losing Gaudreau for him isn't enough.

 

DeAngelo... Don't like him.  It sucks to see Adam Fox is going to be a good one... Basically playing his way to #2 on the depth chart after Trouba.  Maybe even be the Rangers best Damn soon.  DeAngelo has good potential but sounds like a locker room problem.

 

Only other asset worth considering is the Rangers #13 overall pick.  Depends who is still on the board but that's something I wouldn't mind.

 

I highly doubt it, I think Kakko is untouchable. Maybe if they wanted to try for Eichel but I don't see a scenario where they trade Kakko for Gaudreau unless the Flames added something dumb. 

 

I don't have much interest in DeAngelo either. I'm not worried about his attitude as I think he's matured and isn't really a problem but I more worry you are acquiring him at his peak. He's going to be expensive and while he's a wicked offensive player he's got defensive warts. Not an ideal person to pay for. 

 

Picks are interesting for sure. other players that I would have varrying degress of interest in: Andersson, Lindgren, Georgiev (although i'm not sure I value him that highly as I don't see a high end starter), Buchnevich, Chytil, Kravstov, K'Andre Miller, Libor Hjack.

 

Lots of quantity for sure and some decent upside players there. I do think the Rangers would be willing to give them up which is why they may be an attractive partner. 

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24 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

 

Hamonic doesn't deserve more, but as a coveted RHD, he will get a raise from his 3.8. If it's not from the Flames, WPG, TOR etc will give it to him

 

Someone will be desperate enough and dumb enough.  I hope it's the Oilers or Canucks. I hope it's not us.

 

As soon as Hamonic has to defend first line opponents, he's exposed.  You only want to use Hamonic against 3rd/4th liners.

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1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

Could we get Kaapo Kakko with Gaudreau?  We will have to add but Kakko is going to be elite one day.  It's weird Gaudreau would be a target considering Rangers just extended LW Panarin and LW Kreider long term.  The Rangers have proven to have no patience for kids so maybe Kakko for Gaudreau+ gets it done.

 

Georgiev is only a slight upgrade over Rittich... Although we could add him as a new tandem.  I like Georgiev... But losing Gaudreau for him isn't enough.

 

DeAngelo... Don't like him.  It sucks to see Adam Fox is going to be a good one... Basically playing his way to #2 on the depth chart after Trouba.  Maybe even be the Rangers best Damn soon.  DeAngelo has good potential but sounds like a locker room problem.

 

Only other asset worth considering is the Rangers #13 overall pick.  Depends who is still on the board but that's something I wouldn't mind.


 

yup! Still pissed about what the Flames got for Fox. People are still butt hurt about the Gilmour  trade. I can still be hurt about a trade that happened two years ago. Others were hurt about Martin St. Louis For awhile too. I think this management could’ve gotten more in a separate deal and not have him as the throw in last piece. 
 

I would hope Kakko was the piece. Is he enough? 
 

kakko + 1st

for

Gaudreau + Bennett

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