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Lines and Pairings for 2018/19 Season

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1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

You would have to think that if Bennett is going to be out for a bit longer that Mangiapane is going to slide into the 3rd line and Quine goes in on the 4th line.

 

If it were up to me the bottom 6 would look like this:

 

Mangiapane-Ryan-Czarnik

Quine-Jankowski-Hathaway

 

I do get the idea that that's a small 3rd line and they might get pushed around, but I would argue that they all possess the speed and smarts to compensate for lack of size. 

 

I think it's pretty clear at this point that Ryan is the better player than Jankowski, and think he should be playing higher in the lineup than the 4th line.

 

Honestly what I like best about the 4th line is that I think they've really busted this whole idea that your 4th line needs to be big and tough. You can wear a team down with speed and possession too and thats that line to a T right now. I hope they continue to bust the narrative on that. 

 

I agree in theory what you are saying but honestly right now I would not break up that line. I would start using that as my 3rd line and use the Janko line as my 4th. I thikn that line is playing too well right now to split it up. 

 

Going to be interesting to see how they get Neal back in there. Sucks, because I think Czarnik's played well and I don't want to see him come out but he's going to have to.

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2 hours ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

The best young players in ALL the big 4 leagues start out that early, but for some reason hockey players are the least intelligent of the bunch? I'm sure you have plenty of examples of that that don't carry over to the other leagues.

 

I'm not sure how this thread got twisted, nor did I say hockey players are the least intelligent. Simply stated that the best young hockey players/kids today go straight to the NHL once drafted. Some posters continue to discuss player intelligence and how smart they are, I was simple pointing out where they come from. Some have clarified that they were talking about the players "hockey smarts" and not their overall "intelligence".

 

But while we are on the topic, basket ball players hone their skills while in college, football players hone their skills while in college. I don't watch basket ball and I watch less NFL all the time, but do those leagues have 18-19 yr olds in them?

 

Look at the generational NHL players of today and the past, note what colleges or universities they went to. The hockey players that did go to college or university were the ones that were not yet good enough for the league. You could cherry pick a player or three but for the most part hockey players are not highly educated before entering the league.
 

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1 hour ago, CheersMan said:

 

I'm not sure how this thread got twisted, nor did I say hockey players are the least intelligent. Simply stated that the best young hockey players/kids today go straight to the NHL once drafted. Some posters continue to discuss player intelligence and how smart they are, I was simple pointing out where they come from. Some have clarified that they were talking about the players "hockey smarts" and not their overall "intelligence".

 

But while we are on the topic, basket ball players hone their skills while in college, football players hone their skills while in college. I don't watch basket ball and I watch less NFL all the time, but do those leagues have 18-19 yr olds in them?

 

Look at the generational NHL players of today and the past, note what colleges or universities they went to. The hockey players that did go to college or university were the ones that were not yet good enough for the league. You could cherry pick a player or three but for the most part hockey players are not highly educated before entering the league.
 

How many highly regarded B ball/football prospects do you think are taking their education seriously when they're in college?  Besides it's apples to oranges comparing college hockey to any of the other sports at that level, especially stateside. The pressure and expectations on a college athlete in basketball and football especially is enormous.

 

Whether it's any of the big 4 sports I don't think any teams are gonna care if a players grades or class selection aren't perfect.

 

Not trying to be a dick but just wondering why you singled out hockey players.

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2 hours ago, CheersMan said:

 

I'm not sure how this thread got twisted, nor did I say hockey players are the least intelligent. Simply stated that the best young hockey players/kids today go straight to the NHL once drafted. Some posters continue to discuss player intelligence and how smart they are, I was simple pointing out where they come from. Some have clarified that they were talking about the players "hockey smarts" and not their overall "intelligence".

 

But while we are on the topic, basket ball players hone their skills while in college, football players hone their skills while in college. I don't watch basket ball and I watch less NFL all the time, but do those leagues have 18-19 yr olds in them?

 

Look at the generational NHL players of today and the past, note what colleges or universities they went to. The hockey players that did go to college or university were the ones that were not yet good enough for the league. You could cherry pick a player or three but for the most part hockey players are not highly educated before entering the league.
 

 

I think what is getting misunderstood here is that when myself or other posters talk about a players hockey IQ, we are referring to their ability to think while on the ice and how quickly they reacted to situations. Hockey IQ is just a hockey buzz word. My new favorite one is situational awareness, the ability to not only think the game but to also take the situation of the game into account when making decisions during a game.

 

I think a guy like Derek Ryan is one of the smartest players on the team and I get why Peters relies on him so much. Last night the puck deflected high into the air and everybody lost sight of it, except Ryan and he jumped up and knocked the puck out of the air potentially saving a goal. To that's a small example, but it's those small things that add up and make Ryan a very good player.

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Can we afford a 4th line playing like it’s a 3rd or 2nd line right now? Mangiapane and Hath will be getting raises I’m sure...

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There goes some forward depth, though he was behind Quine and Dube on the depth chart at LW anyways. This hurts the Heats chances of making a run at the playoffs more than hurts the Flames chances in the playoffs.

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9 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Honestly what I like best about the 4th line is that I think they've really busted this whole idea that your 4th line needs to be big and tough. You can wear a team down with speed and possession too and thats that line to a T right now. I hope they continue to bust the narrative on that. 

 

I agree in theory what you are saying but honestly right now I would not break up that line. I would start using that as my 3rd line and use the Janko line as my 4th. I thikn that line is playing too well right now to split it up. 

 

Going to be interesting to see how they get Neal back in there. Sucks, because I think Czarnik's played well and I don't want to see him come out but he's going to have to.

 

I know Neal prefers RW because he can get his one timers off, but that hasn't been happening this year. If he is ready to go I wonder if he would be willing to play LW. 

Neal-Jankowski-Czarnik. I mean it's all shooters, but the top 2 lines aren't getting touched, and the 4th line is rolling.

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15 hours ago, rickross said:

Can we afford a 4th line playing like it’s a 3rd or 2nd line right now? Mangiapane and Hath will be getting raises I’m sure...

You can always trade players

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14 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

I know Neal prefers RW because he can get his one timers off, but that hasn't been happening this year. If he is ready to go I wonder if he would be willing to play LW. 

Neal-Jankowski-Czarnik. I mean it's all shooters, but the top 2 lines aren't getting touched, and the 4th line is rolling.

I believe Neal as played both sides so with Bennett out it could be way to get him in there. I would prefer Ryan at C over Jankowski

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15 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

I know Neal prefers RW because he can get his one timers off, but that hasn't been happening this year. If he is ready to go I wonder if he would be willing to play LW. 

Neal-Jankowski-Czarnik. I mean it's all shooters, but the top 2 lines aren't getting touched, and the 4th line is rolling.

 

The 4th line is rolling, but you can also say that Mangiapane and Ryan can play with whomever.

Czarnik is comfortable playing LW.

 

I think that Mangiapane-Ryan-Neal is probably your best best for a suitable third line.

Mangiapane creates.

Ryan is a RHS to feed Neal.

Both Mange and Neal are shooters.

Leaves you a 4th line of Czarnik-Janko-Hathaway, which is not a huge change.  They have played together in different combos.

 

The other option is Janko switching with Ryan.  Has had some success with Neal.

 

I'm not mentioning Bennett because I think he's injured more than what he was telling the coach and trainers.

I think it goes back to that hit on the boards.

 

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I'm sure he will, but is there a rule saying Neal has to draw back in?  Is he a better offensive option than anyone he replaces?  Not based on this season.  Is he a faster than anyone he would replace?  No.  Kill penalties?  No.  Bigger/stronger?  Sure.  

 

Here's hoping he turns his season around.  

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1 hour ago, stubblejumper1 said:

I'm sure he will, but is there a rule saying Neal has to draw back in?  Is he a better offensive option than anyone he replaces?  Not based on this season.  Is he a faster than anyone he would replace?  No.  Kill penalties?  No.  Bigger/stronger?  Sure.  

 

Here's hoping he turns his season around.  

 

Considering that Bennett is out, that's where Neal is drawing in.

The 3rd line has not been effective in scoring over the last number of games, except when Mange played there.

Bennett has been cold for the last month.

Two games where he factored into scoring; NJ and Ottawa.

I suspect he's been hiding his injury.

Was it against PITTS that he was nailed aganst the boards?

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20 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Considering that Bennett is out, that's where Neal is drawing in.

The 3rd line has not been effective in scoring over the last number of games, except when Mange played there.

Bennett has been cold for the last month.

Two games where he factored into scoring; NJ and Ottawa.

I suspect he's been hiding his injury.

Was it against PITTS that he was nailed aganst the boards?

I would rather see BP keep Neal on his favored side with Mangiapane and Ryan. Push Jankowski down to the 4th line to C Quine and Hathaway or use Czarnik on his off wing.

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54 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

I would rather see BP keep Neal on his favored side with Mangiapane and Ryan. Push Jankowski down to the 4th line to C Quine and Hathaway or use Czarnik on his off wing.

 

I was saying that earlier.  Czarnik used to play on LW and Neal is more comfortable on RW.

I really didn;t like what I saw last night with Neal-Janko-Czarnik.

Then again, BP loves the 4th line the way it is.

It's an ace in the hole for him for teams that play matchup.

Probably one of the best 4th lines in the league.

 

Then again, maybe all we need to do is try some stuff with the 1st and 3rd lines and leave the other two alone.

Lindholm and Monahan are ice cold.

Missing plays like there is no tomorrow.

JH is getting frustrated by off sides and lack of finish.

 

JH-Lindholm-Neal

Janko-Monahan-Czarnik

 

Just a thought.  The optics are bad, but I have to see some improvement by Monahan and Lindholm.

Frolik responded by being dropped.

Czarnik was great when he first got back into the lineup.

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36 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I was saying that earlier.  Czarnik used to play on LW and Neal is more comfortable on RW.

I really didn;t like what I saw last night with Neal-Janko-Czarnik.

Then again, BP loves the 4th line the way it is.

It's an ace in the hole for him for teams that play matchup.

Probably one of the best 4th lines in the league.

 

Then again, maybe all we need to do is try some stuff with the 1st and 3rd lines and leave the other two alone.

Lindholm and Monahan are ice cold.

Missing plays like there is no tomorrow.

JH is getting frustrated by off sides and lack of finish.

 

JH-Lindholm-Neal

Janko-Monahan-Czarnik

 

Just a thought.  The optics are bad, but I have to see some improvement by Monahan and Lindholm.

Frolik responded by being dropped.

Czarnik was great when he first got back into the lineup.

I think Monahan will be fine with additional ice time. Lindholm has been doing lots out there and is responsible for a lot of that line's success so leave them together. The 3M line so be it as we don't hae anything better for now. Neal lack of success IMO is the lack of a playmaker on any of his lines combinations so far. I have been waiting to see if Ryan and Mangiapane have it in them and they have now risen to the challenge. Ryan can be a playmaker because he thinks the game. Mangiapane has made himself into a hard working force which can be good as a distraction to free up Neal for what he does best. Lesser minutes for Jankowski on the 4th line won't kill us and Hathaway will make sure the line maintains its efforts.

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One of the reasons the 4th line might be effective is that they’re up against other team’s 4th lines. Slot them lower and they end up having a tougher time? Maybe?

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32 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

One of the reasons the 4th line might be effective is that they’re up against other team’s 4th lines. Slot them lower and they end up having a tougher time? Maybe?

We talk about the importance of chemistry all the time and I think just now some is coming together. It doesn't happen by accident IMO or shouldn't. If you want 3 or even for scoring lines usually requires a playmaker, hard board worker and a good sniper. You take Gaudreau, Monahan and Lindholm's success, all exceptionally talented but all do what they are best at very well. You take Tkachuk, Backlund and Frolik all good players but Tkachuk as the playmaker brings out the other parts of Backlund and Frolik's game making them even better. You take Bennett, Jankowski and Neal there is no playmaker just a hard working board LW in Bennett and a sniper in Neal, Jankowski isn't quite any of these styles yet. Ryan has finally emerge as a lesser version of Lindholm IMO but its all good. I would slot him with Neal and Mangiapane for now and try Bennett on LW as well later.

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3 hours ago, robrob74 said:

One of the reasons the 4th line might be effective is that they’re up against other team’s 4th lines. Slot them lower and they end up having a tougher time? Maybe?

 

On the road, that is unlikely.

The 4th gets the top line when the other teams has last change

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51 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

On the road, that is unlikely.

The 4th gets the top line when the other teams has last change

Yeah I agree. Also, they've been controlling the play vs every team.

4th Line Magic!!

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18 hours ago, robrob74 said:

One of the reasons the 4th line might be effective is that they’re up against other team’s 4th lines. Slot them lower and they end up having a tougher time? Maybe?

So they maybe go even, but don't score. And instead they give more scoring chances to the 3M line? The top line? The third line is the weakest, but Neal was playing really well before his injury (8 points in 10 previous games I believe), and Czarnik has been pretty good as well. The thing about our Depth is that we have 3 lines that can reliably score, a fourth line (technically it's the third line) that is capable of breaking out, a PP that can be pretty deadly, and a PK that has almost 20 goals on the season. Now there are definitely tweaks we could make, but it's definitely hard to line match when every line can do some damage.

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1 hour ago, Khrox said:

So they maybe go even, but don't score. And instead they give more scoring chances to the 3M line? The top line? The third line is the weakest, but Neal was playing really well before his injury (8 points in 10 previous games I believe), and Czarnik has been pretty good as well. The thing about our Depth is that we have 3 lines that can reliably score, a fourth line (technically it's the third line) that is capable of breaking out, a PP that can be pretty deadly, and a PK that has almost 20 goals on the season. Now there are definitely tweaks we could make, but it's definitely hard to line match when every line can do some damage.

 

I would say that the top line and the 3rd line are struggling right now.  Neither Monahan nor Lindholm has looked great over the past month.  I can deal with that, as they need a string of home games to get the favorable matchups they need.  The 3rd line has gone cold.  Very little production.  Scored upon more often.  It may be as good a time as any to try a few tweaks.  You have a couple of games to try it out, but can always go back to original if it doesn’t work out, even within a game.

 

JH-Lindholm-Neal
3M
Mangiapane-Monahan-Ryan
Czarnik-Janko-Hathaway

 

This takes advantage of a lull in Monahan’s play to get Neal some quality linemates. Monahan gets two players that can pass and shoot, pllus Ryan can take strong side draws. Neal gets an elite playmake to set him up, while Lindholm may actually rediscover his shot playing in the middle. The 4th line puts three guys that can skate together. Hathaway can annoy players while Czarnik can get open. He’s also played a lot (in the past) on LW.

 

Radical, I know.  I think they need to take some pressure off Monahan right now, as there is something affecting him.  Play him with two guys that play the right way.  More direct offense.  To keep up his minutes, you can always double shift him on the top line, if he's feeling it.  Doc has been a good remedy for players struggling.  Mangiapane is a smart hockey player, but also can come out from the scrum with the puck.  Worth a try.

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8 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I would say that the top line and the 3rd line are struggling right now.  Neither Monahan nor Lindholm has looked great over the past month.  I can deal with that, as they need a string of home games to get the favorable matchups they need.  The 3rd line has gone cold.  Very little production.  Scored upon more often.  It may be as good a time as any to try a few tweaks.  You have a couple of games to try it out, but can always go back to original if it doesn’t work out, even within a game.

 

JH-Lindholm-Neal
3M
Mangiapane-Monahan-Ryan
Czarnik-Janko-Hathaway

 

This takes advantage of a lull in Monahan’s play to get Neal some quality linemates. Monahan gets two players that can pass and shoot, pllus Ryan can take strong side draws. Neal gets an elite playmake to set him up, while Lindholm may actually rediscover his shot playing in the middle. The 4th line puts three guys that can skate together. Hathaway can annoy players while Czarnik can get open. He’s also played a lot (in the past) on LW.

 

Radical, I know.  I think they need to take some pressure off Monahan right now, as there is something affecting him.  Play him with two guys that play the right way.  More direct offense.  To keep up his minutes, you can always double shift him on the top line, if he's feeling it.  Doc has been a good remedy for players struggling.  Mangiapane is a smart hockey player, but also can come out from the scrum with the puck.  Worth a try.

These are not tweaks and hardly moves to make just before you go into the playoffs.

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42 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

These are not tweaks and hardly moves to make just before you go into the playoffs.

IF you're going to try something like this, this is probably the best time, like TD stated you can always go back next game. Or do you feel comfortable that Lindy, Mony and the 3rd line will break out of their slump in time for playoffs?

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48 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

IF you're going to try something like this, this is probably the best time, like TD stated you can always go back next game. Or do you feel comfortable that Lindy, Mony and the 3rd line will break out of their slump in time for playoffs?

It is essential that our1st line be back together now working on things together. We aren't going anywhere without them leading the way.

As far as our 3rd line goes or our 4th line we haven't really known who is where and when all season. Focus should be here now with Neal coming back in.

I love that players such as Ryan, Mangiapane, Czarnik and Hathaway have picked up the slack because its a good testament to our depth. Now BP needs to best deploy them. Personally I would go with Mangiapane, Ryan and Neal heading into the playoffs. If Bennett makes it back I would go Bennett, Jankowski, Hathaway for the 4th line. Use Czarnik on his off wing until Bennett makes it back or give Quine some games.

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