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Discussion & Debate Thread: Flames and Canucks

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Wow.. i never realized how dire the Canucks salary structure is... lots of overpaid players.

On the other hand... look at ALLLL the bargain contracts on the flames... Go Feaster Go!

But can any team win with a bunch of cheap bargain bin talent?

Would you rather overpay for a high quality products at designer shops...

Or would you rather look for cheap high value products from the bargain bin at value village?

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Wow.. i never realized how dire the Canucks salary structure is... lots of overpaid players.

On the other hand... look at ALLLL the bargain contracts on the flames... Go Feaster Go!

But can any team win with a bunch of cheap bargain bin talent?

Would you rather overpay for a high quality products at designer shops...

Or would you rather look for cheap high value products from the bargain bin at value village?

luongo_dumpster.jpg

:)

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Enough with the past Donnie, Get a grip on the future k!

Lets talk about current Contracts, Overpaid, or good value players on both teams

Vancouver Canucks:

Sedins (Overpaid) for players just cracking 70 points making 6.1 Million is a slight over payment

Kesler (Way Overpaid) 5million for a player just getting 40 points is a joke

Malhotra (Overpaid) 2.5 million to some one who can't skate, can't shoot or pass, the only thing he can do satisfactory is faceoffs is one of Gillis's worst signings ever

Burrows (Good Value) 2million for a player who's been consistently scoring is one of Vancouver only good signings.

Garrison (Way overpaid) 1 season of NHL play with 33 points and the rest of his career in the AHL has got to be the worst signing in the history of the NHL

Ballard (Way overpaid) No explanation needed here. Canucks Fans are sour about this

Luongo (Way overpaid) 10million last season for a goalie who was sitting during clutch Playoff games. I was laughing till today on that one. Good luck Canucks fans trying to get rid of that outrageous contract.

Schneider (overpaid) 4million for a back up goalie who has yet to prove himself as a starter or a goalie who can carry a season of 50 games plus

Calgary Flames

Iginla (Fair Value) 7million for a guaranteed 30+ goal a season guy (averages about 40G per season)

Hudler (Bargain) 4million for the best two way player in the past 2-3 seasons

Glencross (Bargain) 2.5 Million for a player who can put up 26G in 67Games

Backlund (Bargain) .675 Million for a bright prospect! Canucks don't even have one prospect in their system! lol

Baertschi (Bargain) at under 1.5M per season, probably the best young prospect in the NHL that is upcoming! watch out Canucks fans

JBo (Fair Value) 6.6Mil for the best defensive and best skating Dman in the League

Wideman (Bargain) 5.25Mil - Wideman took a big discount to play with a Stanley Cup contender. Could have fetched 6.5Mil anywhere else. He has great faith in our team.

Kiprusoff (Bargain) at 5.8Mil for the most consistent starting goalie since he's brought our team to the Finals.

Whats exciting? our team is filled up with many young talented prospects while Canucks are just relying on Old - past their prime type players in the core because they their drafting is the worst in the NHL.

Holy Crap! Your right Derf!!!

And the Canucks have 1/2 a mill. less than the Flames do in Cap space as of right now but only have 22 guys signed... the Flames have a full 23 man roster signed!!!

I really don't know what Gillis is going to do :( but atleast he should be able to unload Luongo to Florida for Gudbranson & Skille. That should save us about a mill. on the Cap and give us one good prospect cuz eveybody knows just how bad the Canucks draft and develop players.

The window for a Cup is closed shut and the players are way overpaid. We Got to do what Edmonton did and what Vancouverites do best...burn it to the ground. ;)

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Holy Crap! Your right Derf!!!

And the Canucks have 1/2 a mill. less than the Flames do in Cap space as of right now but only have 22 guys signed... the Flames have a full 23 man roster signed!!!

I really don't know what Gillis is going to do :( but atleast he should be able to unload Luongo to Florida for Gudbranson & Skille. That should save us about a mill. on the Cap and give us one good prospect cuz eveybody knows just how bad the Canucks draft and develop players.

The window for a Cup is closed shut and the players are way overpaid. We Got to do what Edmonton did and what Vancouverites do best...burn it to the ground. ;)

You don't have to burn the team to the ground. Canucks still have a decent team. Probably be able to contend for a playoff spot. I just don't see the Canucks roster being good enough on paper to contend for a cup. If Vancouver's roster had some players who are willing to play for less to be on a winning team like a good handful of the Flames players, that would enable you to get key signings like Wideman and etc. Players like Wideman, Hudler, Cervenka, Backlund, Stempy, Comeau, Sarich took less money to play on a Stanley Cup contending team. All the players mentioned could have gotten better dollar elsewhere.

Our prospects give us a bright future as well. I'm sorry to say this to the Canucks fans but there are zero prospects in Vancouver's organization, You guys got a bunch of Career AHL'rs though.

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You don't have to burn the team to the ground. Canucks still have a decent team. Probably be able to contend for a playoff spot. I just don't see the Canucks roster being good enough on paper to contend for a cup. If Vancouver's roster had some players who are willing to play for less to be on a winning team like a good handful of the Flames players, that would enable you to get key signings like Wideman and etc. Players like Wideman, Hudler, Cervenka, Backlund, Stempy, Comeau, Sarich took less money to play on a Stanley Cup contending team. All the players mentioned could have gotten better dollar elsewhere.

Our prospects give us a bright future as well. I'm sorry to say this to the Canucks fans but there are zero prospects in Vancouver's organization, You guys got a bunch of Career AHL'rs though.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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I'd rather do something like a trade that is similar to this.

JBo, Iggy for Kesler, Booth, Higgins & 1st rounder.

Canucks get back some offensive firepower and a top dman which they are lacking in depth. They currently carry 4-5 AHL caliber dman on their team right now and could use a depth increase on the back line. Flames would need a 1st rounder to balance the trade out as Kesler & Booth are past their prime.

(Facepalm) This trade is a terrible deal I wouldn't trade Kesler for Iginla or Boumesster straight up, and apperently Kesler and Booth are past there prime but Jarome Iginla isn't?

Kesler had a 40 goal year last season and came back from injury that he didn't full recover from, he had an up and down season but I don't understand why he can't be the player he was, and we have seen glimpses of it since the injury too. And Booth got injured or else he would have put up 20-25, he was just starting to get his game going and he was on pace for 20+.

Boumesster is overpaid, I've been a fan of his since his FLA days but he's overrated, I would much rather stick with Edler than take on Boumesster.

So you think that

A: Canucks would want JBo and..

B: Would trade Kesler or Higgens

But yet you call Canucks fans ignorant? Wow.

Nobody want's that bloated JBo contract. Bury him in Abbotsford if you wanna free up that space.

Kesler would never agree to be traded to Calgary.

And you had your chance with Higgens before and you gave up on him. As did other teams. It took a seriously well run team like the Canucks to get him to act like a pro, and it's paying huge dividends now.

Thank you! A sensible fan, +1

I don't remember who said this but

x-factor in the trade is the asset Gragnani.

Lets see here

Sulzer 15GP 3G 5A 8PTs vs Gragnani 13GP 1G 2A 3PTs (Don't forget my friend Donald said Buffalo scores a lot less than the Canucks thus the decline in performance in Ehrhoffs stats = that's a bunch of BS anyways)

Looks like it was the x-factor in getting owned on the trade. Way to drop the ball on this one Gillis!

Lets take a look at the other trade Gillis blew his load too early on.

Hodgson 18GP 3G 5A 8Pts vs Kassian 17GP 1G 2A 3PTs.

Lol @ how my friend Donald thinks the trade worked for both teams. It's working for Buffalo ok, can't say the same about the Canucks. With Kesler going cold, they could use Hodgson production down the center right about now or even in the playoffs! Donald the Foig

Okay.. (facepalm) Again.

Hodgson wanted to be traded, that really doesn't leave alot of options.

And Kassian is younger than Cody so to expect him to be the same or better is unfair, but the main reason he wasn't better is because of our idiot coach AV.

He put him on the 4th line, then against Buffalo he had a great game, scored a goal on the 2nd line and played really well as I said. Then what happens?

Kassian is back on the 4th line to start the next game.

Atleast Gillis isn't as dumb as Feaster.

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It's funny, absolutely hilarious the two completely different directions the Flames and Canucks are heading.

You got that right, the Canucks are looking to maintain there spot as one of the best teams in the league and the Flames are looking to finally make the playoffs.

While the Flames are gearing up to becoming a true Stanley cup contender (something us champions are use to - winning - unlike the Canucks who are content of getting eliminated after a few games in the playoffs!), the Canucks are focus on just trying to build a mediocer team, just trying to get into the playoffs.

That makes a ton of sense, the best team in league over the last 4 years isn't more of a contender than the team that has made the playoffs once in that entire time.

Why would we build a mediocre team? we have been one of the best teams, while you guys go through mediocrity with aging players and a future that doesn't look bright.

Look at our acquisitions this summer Hudler, Cervenka, Wideman, the resigning of Stempy and Sarich. It gives me goose bumps for next year thinking about the stacked and the depth our roster has. Feaster has Stanley Cup Champions written all over this years roster. On paper we are about 4 times the team the Canucks will ever be in their history of NHL.

Okay lets review your "Great Acquisitions"

- You paid 4 Million for a guy who has never play and NHL game in Cervenka.

- You overpayed, for basicly a one-dimensional player in Wideman.

- You re-signed a player who hasn't scored 20 goals since the long lost season of 06-07 in Stepniak

- Hudler is a good player, but he isn't consistent, haasn't shown consistent career production, it's good season, bad season, good season, bad season and he won't be as good in Calgary

Yeah that's really A+ Work.

When I compare to Loser Gillis's signings. I L'd.O.L for a few hours at Garrison's signing. So I guess if you just play some decent hockey for one season and get about half the points Wideman and just a 10th of his career, you deserve 90% of Wideman's salary. That is an absolute joke. Gillis loves to smoke crack before he goes into contract negotiations. Of course, Donnie and DL are going to say something else because of the canucks rose colour glasses.

Omg I wish you guys had the Facepalm emotion so I don't have to keep saying (Facepalm).

Garrison > Wideman and here is why.

Yes Garrison has only had one good Offensive season, but he's in his prime, he a big guy who can play a ton of minutes, he has the big shot but he also is great defensively, he is a two-way player who is great in any situation. Wideman got overpayed for having a good season point's wise, just like Erhoff did last year for us.

Did you see Erhoff this year? He went from 50 points and +19 to 30 points and -2, The Canucks made him better and he got drasticly overpaid for it.

The same thing will happen with Wideman, maybe not as big of a drop off, but the same thing. I'm a big fan of his but his point totals won't be what they were with the caps.

Enjoy the first overall pick of next years draft Canucks fans, while we're stuck at picking 30th.

It's funny because in the real world it's the exact opposite, our team is much closer to the 30th pick and yours is much closer to having the 1st overall.

Overall I only had to read the few senteces of your post and I burst out laughing, so thanks for that.

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It's funny, absolutely hilarious the two completely different directions the Flames and Canucks are heading.

While the Flames are gearing up to becoming a true Stanley cup contender (something us champions are use to - winning - unlike the Canucks who are content of getting eliminated after a few games in the playoffs!), the Canucks are focus on just trying to build a mediocer team, just trying to get into the playoffs.

Look at our acquisitions this summer Hudler, Cervenka, Wideman, the resigning of Stempy and Sarich. It gives me goose bumps for next year thinking about the stacked and the depth our roster has. Feaster has Stanley Cup Champions written all over this years roster. On paper we are about 4 times the team the Canucks will ever be in their history of NHL.

When I compare to Loser Gillis's signings. I L'd.O.L for a few hours at Garrison's signing. So I guess if you just play some decent hockey for one season and get about half the points Wideman and just a 10th of his career, you deserve 90% of Wideman's salary. That is an absolute joke. Gillis loves to smoke crack before he goes into contract negotiations. Of course, Donnie and DL are going to say something else because of the canucks rose colour glasses.

Enjoy the first overall pick of next years draft Canucks fans, while we're stuck at picking 30th.

Aha

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

AHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

OMFG UR SO FUNNYYY HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yup, because Wideman TOTALLLY Deserves 5M a year

Yup, the Flames are TOTALLLYYY gearing up for a cup run while we are going to pick 1st next season...hahahahahahahahaha

I'm still laughing here

Mygod you're stupid

Smashian Kassian let's blow this joint Flames fans be mad

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It's funny, absolutely hilarious the two completely different directions the Flames and Canucks are heading.

While the Flames are gearing up to becoming a true Stanley cup contender (something us champions are use to - winning - unlike the Canucks who are content of getting eliminated after a few games in the playoffs!), the Canucks are focus on just trying to build a mediocer team, just trying to get into the playoffs.

What do you mean, champions? 1 Stanley Cup victory over 30 years ago means you guys are champions? Bahahaha. When was the last time you noobs made the playoffs?

Also, oh yup we are totally trying to build a medicore team, it must explain our two Presidents Trophies in the last few years, yup we are totally trying to build a medicore team.

Enjoy the first overall pick of next years draft Canucks fans, while we're stuck at picking 30th.

tumblr_m1po0gjoEn1rqfhi2o1_250.gif

Derftrocity and Flames fans be butthurt

Butthurt_pokemons.jpg

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Aha

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

AHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

OMFG UR SO FUNNYYY HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yup, because Wideman TOTALLLY Deserves 5M a year

Yup, the Flames are TOTALLLYYY gearing up for a cup run while we are going to pick 1st next season...hahahahahahahahaha

I'm still laughing here

Mygod you're stupid

Smashian Kassian let's blow this joint Flames fans be mad

Yeee haha, It's stupid how there's no notifications though :/

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While I don't agree with Derf, I think it's pathetic how many nucks fans are creating accounts to join in on a silly conversation... It's pretty sad actually.

This should be fun.

Just a bunch of stupid banter back and forth. No meaningful conversation or debate.

_________________________________

Maybe I can bring some meaningful conversation to this thread, so it's not derailed by trolls....

I've been thinking about the two big names for the nucks hitting the UFA market this coming July.

1. Burrows

2. Edler

What do buck fans think they will make? Cap Hit / Term?

My prediction:

Burrows 4 x 4yrs

Edler 5.5 x 6yrs

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Aha

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

AHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

OMFG UR SO FUNNYYY HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yup, because Wideman TOTALLLY Deserves 5M a year

Yup, the Flames are TOTALLLYYY gearing up for a cup run while we are going to pick 1st next season...hahahahahahahahaha

I'm still laughing here

Mygod you're stupid

Smashian Kassian let's blow this joint Flames fans be mad

watch-out-we-got-a-badass-over-here-meme.png

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While I don't agree with Derf, I think it's pathetic how many nucks fans are creating accounts to join in on a silly conversation... It's pretty sad actually.

Just a bunch of stupid banter back and forth. No meaningful conversation or debate.

_________________________________

Maybe I can bring some meaningful conversation to this thread, so it's not derailed by trolls....

I've been thinking about the two big names for the nucks hitting the UFA market this coming July.

1. Burrows

2. Edler

What do buck fans think they will make? Cap Hit / Term?

My prediction:

Burrows 4 x 4yrs

Edler 5.5 x 6yrs

Those new accounts sound like the child trolls our regular Canuck posters have mentioned are a pain on their own board. Probably incapable of actual debate.

______________________________

My guesses:

Burrows 4.5 x 5. Even that's a discount. I don't like his style but, if he tones down the embellishment the officials no longer buy, he can be an effective player. (This guy has come so far since Zinger found him in the ECHL & signed him for the Moose. He did so well that the Canucks signed him for the big club.)

Edler 5.5 x 6 sounds about right. That's within the ballpark for any top 4 defense.

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the best team in league over the last 4 years

You overpayed, for basicly a one-dimensional player in Wideman.

Garrison > Wideman and here is why.

Yes Garrison has only had one good Offensive season, but he's in his prime,

It's uneducated comments like these that will get you ignored by any hockey fan.

Canucks were NOT the best team in the league for the past 4 years. The Kings, Bruins, Blackhawks and Penguins were.

That comment about Wideman clearly shows how poor your knowledge of hockey is.

According to you, once you have one mediocer offensive season, you are in your prime! lol I seriously dropped in the office and laughed for 7 minutes for 42 seconds on that one.

I will not respond to you anymore because I prefer intelligent discussions with Canucks fans like DL and Donnie.

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Aha

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

AHAHAHAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

OMFG UR SO FUNNYYY HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yup, because Wideman TOTALLLY Deserves 5M a year

Yup, the Flames are TOTALLLYYY gearing up for a cup run while we are going to pick 1st next season...hahahahahahahahaha

I'm still laughing here

Mygod you're stupid

Smashian Kassian let's blow this joint Flames fans be mad

When was the last time you noobs made the playoffs?

Are you 4 years old???

Do you not have any vocabulary, can you not construct a proper grammatical sentence?

PS this discussion board is for educated people with concise ideas for thought out argumentation. Little babies and kids should stay on CDC or play Call on the Duty.

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Maybe I can bring some meaningful conversation to this thread, so it's not derailed by trolls....

I've been thinking about the two big names for the nucks hitting the UFA market this coming July.

1. Burrows

2. Edler

What do buck fans think they will make? Cap Hit / Term?

My prediction:

Burrows 4 x 4yrs

Edler 5.5 x 6yrs

I think the Canucks will at least offer your prediction. The way they are throwing money around and over paying on contracts they signed this summer, it wouldn't surprise me if Burrows gets something like a 5 year x 5.5M contract and Edler gets a 8 year x 7Mil contract. In a real world, especially if Burrows stops concentrating on trying to win an academy award or Edler can lose a few pounds because he was useless this playoffs, they should be able get the money you suggested. Although they would have to consider a pay cut if they wanted a real cup contending team.

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I will not respond to you anymore because I prefer intelligent discussions with Canucks fans like DL and Donnie.

I'm going to hold onto this snippet for later.

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Wow.. i never realized how dire the Canucks salary structure is... lots of overpaid players.

On the other hand... look at ALLLL the bargain contracts on the flames... Go Feaster Go!

But can any team win with a bunch of cheap bargain bin talent?

Would you rather overpay for a high quality products at designer shops...

Or would you rather look for cheap high value products from the bargain bin at value village?

As a frugal guy myself, I'd go for the latter. My modified supercharged S2000 does the same job as a Benz AMG SLK but at about 40% of the cost. I'd choose the s2000 every single time!

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While I don't agree with Derf, I think it's pathetic how many nucks fans are creating accounts to join in on a silly conversation... It's pretty sad actually.

Just a bunch of stupid banter back and forth. No meaningful conversation or debate.

_________________________________

Maybe I can bring some meaningful conversation to this thread, so it's not derailed by trolls....

I've been thinking about the two big names for the nucks hitting the UFA market this coming July.

1. Burrows

2. Edler

What do buck fans think they will make? Cap Hit / Term?

My prediction:

Burrows 4 x 4yrs

Edler 5.5 x 6yrs

I though I made some good points.

His comments were just so outragous I couldn't help laughing and getting a little fired up.

But Getting Burrows and Edler at that price would be a steal.

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It's uneducated comments like these that will get you ignored by any hockey fan.

Your telling me....

Canucks were NOT the best team in the league for the past 4 years. The Kings, Bruins, Blackhawks and Penguins were.

No the Canucks have been the best team in the NHL over the past 4 years.

Out of all those teams The Canucks have: The most wins, fewest losses, most points, 2nd in GF and 2nd in GA.

We also have played in the most playoff series (tied for 1st with Chi) and are tied for 2nd with Pittsburgh in Playoff series wins.

Not to mention we are the only team to win our division in each year.

So in the Gillis era, which has been the past 4 years, we have been the best team.

That comment about Wideman clearly shows how poor your knowledge of hockey is.

According to you, once you have one mediocer offensive season, you are in your prime! lol I seriously dropped in the office and laughed for 7 minutes for 42 seconds on that one.

I will not respond to you anymore because I prefer intelligent discussions with Canucks fans like DL and Donnie.

So a Mediocer offensive season is finishing second in goals behind the Norris Trophy winner? You really need to learn something about hockey.

He had 16 goals and 33 points, he had more goals than Wideman, but Wideman had more points.

And yes he is in his prime, he is 27 and he is coming off his 1st good season so he will bring more good years, I'm not sure how you think he isn't in his prime. You must not know what being in your prime is.

He is also a much better two-way defensemen than Wideman, and I don't think that's debatable at all.

Plus he isn't overpaid like Wideman.

And how come you didn't quote any of my other stuff? Cause you know I was right about that stuff right?

And btw it's uneducated comments like the ones you just made that will get you ignored by smarter hockey fans

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